WHERE DID THE SEXY GO????
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It cracks me up that the same people who go to Zumba routinely will look down their noses at pole. Not all, but many.
FYI! I have 3 kids and I can twerk my ass off!!!! Lol
I agree that the sexy hasn't gone anywhere yet. Yet I see more and more competitions getting stricter about the kinds of outfits, clothing removals ( when learning how to peel off a tank top in CAR was the height of badassery at a certain level of my pole dance training!), and "sexually oriented dancing". So I'm either Queen of the Stripperfest or a "serious, legitimate" pole dancer? I don't think so. I don't think that I will accept that tricking and lyric emo dance needs to be the status quo if I want to be taken seriously as a competitive pole dancer. If people want to make vertical bar gymnastics a thing then rock on. There is no place for me in that realm. I'd love to see more US competitions that encourage the kind of theatrics and sexiness that Miss Pole Dance Australia does.
Sorry - this might not be so relavant, but Chem - can you link to crystal's perormance? I soo wanna see what you are talking about.
Leeloo ·
This piece is amazing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZhCPKWD7FM but noone could call this piece sexy. It is a highly emotional piece that is sending a message, beautifully created and executed. Maybe we're not thinking of the same performance.
Yes, yes you can Ebony. And you are ONE SEXY MOMMA!!!
Leeloo, I think you misunderstood Koidragon. In that piece Crystal bared her soul on stage. Every single movement had meaning. It was a very strong, personal and well thought out performance that was executed not for theater but for competition. It took a lot of balls for her to do that piece. It took a lot of thought for the movements. THAT is sexy. You have to have one hell of a personality to pull that performance off. THAT is sexy. To be able to pull the amount of emotion out of the audience. THAT is sexy. Her piece in an of itself was not "sexy", per se but the thought process to do it was. As Ashton Kutcher just said this past week, being smart is sexy. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZhCPKWD7FM
Veena ·
The sexy may have been "stripped" from some pole styles and competitions and that's fine for those who like pole fitness. Pole DANCE is alive and well here on SV!! We had a sexy challenge last month and our members often post sexy videos! Sexy is not gone :)
REDKE71 ·
I think sexy is still alive and well. Yes, it does seem like in the competition world that people are moving away from it and more towards contemporary dance type pole. Being a sexy dancer myself, I really enjoy all the dance styles currently associated with pole. I feel like there is room for them all. Most ppl know me for my sexy, and heels, and seductive style.. But it doesnt mean its the only way i like to dance. sometimes I like to be sexy, and sometimes I like to be "dancey". I think people just need to remember what attracted them to pole in the first place and just enjoy the fact that there are now so many different pole styles to enjoy..!
are body rolls and booty bounce the only way to represent sexy? is what's sexy for you necessarily sexy for other people? maybe some people are deliberately not doing sexy, but isn't it possible that what looks asexual to one person is what makes the performer feel sexy, then it just becomes an diversifying of what is sexy. why do we have to lament the disappearance of conventional sexiness? to me, this is knock-me-out-of-my-chair sexy, but it might not be for the dancer on the next pole: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUAb-zS7NcM
@CapFeb--no booty, ever? 😲 I didn't know people felt this way! I just watched Chalese's BSB video and damn, does she COMMAND the booty and accent the music perfectly with the pops! Love it!
Veena ·
I LoVE booty moves!!!!! Remember Sparrow we even did a booty challenge!!
Yes, Veena! I remember your ZZ Top dance!!🥂
Chem... you get me... so incredibly well said. That is exactly what I meant. *wipes tear*
I know I'm relatively 'new' to the community, but as the resident budding anthropologist I'd like to point out that fun is relative. I think that's what makes the pole dancing community such an interesting study! The population, though relatively small, is diverse and everyone has finds pole fun for different reasons, though it usually all comes back to self expression and self confidence, which are both individual and extremely subjective experiences. Some people express themselves with their butts, some people do it with their strength and some with their ability to tell a story with their body. When I interviewed Veena, I think she did a great job of describing this--it's not that sexy and pole are being disassociated, it's more like sexy is a subset of pole dancing instead of encompassing pole dancing. I'd also like to point out that while pole dancing may have never been 'meant' to be a sport, that doesn't mean it can't be one. Whenever people bring up a sort of ownership to any form of art (and I do consider pole dancing art) I like to counter with Kant. Before I go any farther, let me explain what I mean by 'ownership'. I mean ascribing characteristics to the apparatus and what it was meant or not meant to be, not that any specific person owns it. It's more like a thought owns it, or an idea, or a process, not an individual person or group. Now that I've cleared that up, back to Kant. His philosophy on art is that once the piece has been given to the public (in this case the pole apparatus) then it is the publics will for what it will become because art is subjective and so is our experience of it. So, since literally anyone can purchase a pole provided they have the funds, than to each and individual person that pole will become what that person wants or perceives it should or is meant to be. However, I do not think it's fair to the pole dancing community, which is so rich in diversity, to be lumped under one category. Not every pole dancer is a sexy dancer, just like not every pole dancer is an acrobat. In that aspect, I think trying to desexualize the pole apparatus in the public eye seems fair, because by detaching the sexy from the pole it allows more freedom in expression for all different styles of pole artistry. Just because the POLE isn't sexy, doesn't mean YOU can't be sexy--you get me? Like SV's idea of treating the exotic, sexy dance style as a subset of pole instead of what pole is. Anyway, I know this is a long winded response, but I've got one last thing to mention. I'm not sure how aware everyone is of this, but in the public eye most of the representations people have for pole dancing comes from porn stars. When I did the 'media' part of my assignment I found that actual pole dancers (all of the names I've come to know, like Jenine Butterfly, Pantera, Alathea and so forth) are invisible in the media. When "pole dancing" comes up, it's usually referring to a woman standing next to a pole dancing sexy (not that there's anything wrong with that, but when people tell me someone 'pole danced' I at least expect to see a cross ankle recline or even a simple spin or two). To me, this is a stylized, rather crude representation of an otherwise vibrant and expressive world! And from what I'm told, the videos from the Porn Stars have more to do with floor work than actual pole dancing (but I've never seen the videos myself, to be fair). Is that really how you guys want to be represented to the masses? Like I said, I don't think there is anything wrong with being sexy--it's a wonderful empowering thing--but I think the mainstream representation today of pole dancing doesn't even give exotic pole dancers the credit they deserve. I mean, I'd rather see Alathea on TV talking about pole dancing than Carmen Electra, one of them is obviously more fit to talk about it than the other. Just my thoughts, sorry for the novel. :)
The way I see it, there are multiple different styles of pole dance. But in my mind, when I think of competitions, I think of 3 "groups" (for lack of a better word). And you can see by the winners of the competitions, which kind of "group" it seems to be looking for. There's the super sexy group, or "stripper style" (complete with hells and booty popping... I think of undeniably sexy dancers like Alethea Austin in this group), the lyrical and theatrical group that isn't as in-your-face sexy but still involves a lot of acting and storytelling through dance (when I looked at the amazing performances from US nationals this year, I thought of this group - Sergia Louise Anderson's performance? Incredible!), and the hard core gymnastic pole group (like IPSF). Let me stress that I'm just loosely grouping these together because that's what I've been noticing - I'm not trying to offend anyone :) Personally, I love all styles of pole dance... just in different venues. I like to play around with "stripper style" but wouldn't want to be competing in that style because it's not my strongest - my body just doesn't naturally move that way with as much ease. I find the lyrical and theatrical style to be incredibly challenging and beyond my reach (for now at least) but would LOVE to get there some day. The gymnastic pole style is more my comfort zone for competing or performances. My body naturally moves this way easier than the other ways. Also, and I know a lot of people might hate this argument, I want to be able to share my performances/competitions with people in my work life! Whether we like it or not, and for the record I don't, society is just not there yet and may never be there. "There" meaning because comfortable with sexuality and sensuality being displayed outside of closed doors. I am a doctor. I am expected to maintain "professionalism" in all areas of my life. I refuse to keep my pole life a secret. I just competed in my first competition and I invited many of my colleagues to come cheer me on. I want to be able to invite them to come watch me and not feel like it's inappropriate for them to do so (especially when it's an older male supervisor or something like that). So, the gymnastic IPSF pole sport style is what I want to share with my professional life. That's my reasoning.
Its ironic & a shame for me to read this. I just came from a discipline where I just couldn't take the divide anymore...between "art" & "industry". There are handfuls within 1000's that recognize the difference. I can say from that experience this...it didn't happen overnight..its probably been an evolution of 100yrs... no matter how few people there are left of the "art" they will find each other to learn from and to share with. And if thats what you want it will find you. Yea I could forcee a day when there's that divide, but i already know that out of a crowd of a 1000 they'll be atleast one person waiting to see the dance that moves them & say to themselves, "I want to be that"...and therefore the sexy will never die.
darcit ·
Thank you ABCsofBejing for saying kind of what I've been thinking. I don't think everyone thinks the same things are sexy. I know that when I see people booty popping, body waving and doing floorwork it doesn't look sexy to me. After years of working in a club it's very hard for me to mentally connect that with "sexy". To me, seeing that is about as sexy as it would be for someone who works at McDonalds to hear "Do you want fries with that." I'm not saying it's not sexy to some people - and that's awesome for them. I want them to be able to continue to embrace that kind of sexy, watch it, do it, and celebrate it. But I also want to be able to watch, do and celebrate the kind of pole that I find awesome and sexy without being afraid of being accused of wanting to take the "sexy" out of pole. I don't. For me the passionate, theatrical performances, the ones where someone is telling a story with their motions, music, props and body are by and far the most sexy. There might not be a booty pop, body roll, or floorwork in the whole thing. Sad, strong, funny, happy - for me it's the depth of emotion that is sexy, regardless of what that emotion is. Sometimes it's nothing more than the joy of performing something they love for people who appreciate it. Someone is dropping their "wall" allowing us to see inside them for just a moment. I don't want pole to be less sexy. But I do want people to understand that when I say I love the amazing, gymnastic pole performances, I see sexy there too.
Veena ·
I agree with you guys about booty stuff I would say that it isn't "sexy"! However, it's super fun for a lot of us and seen as "sexual" by most. My guess is that's why the girls include booty moves in the sexy category. I think sexy is slinky, smooth and raw! Booty moves are sexual so I can see why they're included in this thread.
I find a really good storytelling performance to be amazing to watch, too. And yes, I too can find "the sexy" in routines that are not your classic stripper-style dances. ( By the way, I did not find Crystal's performance "sexy". Powerful, brave and amazing, yes. But I couldn't find a routine set to a song about lynching sexy. I don't think it was her intention anyway). But I do find the current trend towards aseptic gymnastic routines set to the background noise of a contemporary song rather boring. Hopefully it will swing back soon. While there should always be room in pole for everyone to express themselves and push themselves, the ripple effect of what's trending in competitions currently is worthy of discussion because it affects how non-competitive polers see themselves, it affects what gets taught in studios and in the end it does affect what competitions become popular and what we have access to.
Kate O ·
I very much agree with Leeloo's ("noone could call this piece sexy. It is a highly emotional piece that is sending a message, beautifully created and executed") and Black Orchid's comment: "By the way, I did not find Crystal's performance "sexy". Powerful, brave and amazing, yes. But I couldn't find a routine set to a song about lynching sexy. I don't think it was her intention anyway." I realise that I'm probably going against popular opinion here and I don't want to ruffle any feathers - but why is there such a need for everything to be sexy? Yes, I can enjoy and appreciate the sexy side of pole dance and I realise that the 'sexy' kind is mostly where all the other kinds (gymnastic, artistic etc) originated from, but everyone should be free to dance however they like, sexy or otherwise, and trying to call Crystal's performance sexy seems silly to me. It seems almost dismissive of all the deep thought and emotion and soul she must have put into her routine, which as she has said herself on YouTube was designed to make a statement, and I don't think for even a second that that statement was "I'm sexy". Sexy has its place but to me, and I can't speak for her but I would imagine to Crystal as well, her routine was not that place. Sorry if anyone thinks I'm being rude, I hope that isn't the case, I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter (and I realise that this is a little off-topic of the whole thread). As for the thread as a whole, I fully understand some people's dislike for the stricter rules some competitions are putting in place, but as others have said there is more than enough room for all styles of pole. I'm not a huge fan of competitions that require competitors to wear heels, for example, as they can be uncomfortable and sometimes dangerous, but I hear less people complaining about that than I do about the "no heels" rule. Each to their own, I suppose - there are different styles of performance and competition so there is something to suit every poler, and no one style is going to stamp out the other.
Kate92, you basically said exactly what I was thinking. To me, gymnastic pole can be sexy... if I am not prescribing to a typical definition of the word "sexy". To me, I would call a piece sexy if it's sexually suggestive (lots of booty, or grazing, body rolls, incredibly slinky, or even just the attitude, etc). I would not in any way consider Crystal's piece suggestive, so I wouldn't call it a sexy pole piece, even though it was amazing and mind-blowing. To me, sexy = strong, sexy= smart, etc but I don't tend to use those definitions when describing things other than humans. I don't tend to use it for things like dances, dresses, films, chemical reactions (I had a prof who did that, hehe) etc. At the same time sexy pole can at times be... not exactly something I enjoy watching. It goes both ways, as I would assume it would for everyone, based on individual tastes. Whether I like sexy pole (I do) or not, when I see an awesome gymnastic or contemporary dance piece, I'm still gonna like it. But it doesn't have to be sexy to be awesome to me. I don't really think that sexy has gone from pole. It may not be de rigueur for some of the larger competitions now, but it very well may trend back. And I think a big reason it seems like its not the forefront, is because the media doesn't report on the studios empowering women nearly as much as it likes to report pole is attempting to get into the Olympics, or pole dancing for kids (gasp?!), etc. I think because of the Olympic push, a lot of the pole people going to the media tends to be trying to legitimize pole as a sport, which just doesn't include the sexy.
Totally off topic sorry...corbyOconnor, I had a prof at UCD that described Chemical reactions as sexy too!!!! Lmao
Kate O ·
Corby its good to know someone else feels the same :) you pretty much summed up my feelings in one sentence - 'It doesn't have to be sexy to be awesome to me.'
I'm totally with you in this, for me pole dance is all about the sexy, of course it is also a great excersise and doing it for fitness is totally fine, but when people try to eliminate the sexy on it, it kind of stops being the same, what's the point of pole dancing if I can't be sexy while doing it?
