trouble with reverse grab

HollySatine started this discussion · 5/9/2011

I feel like I can't get enough momentum into this move, or maybe my legs are doing something wrong - when I do this spin, I kick out and around, but after I kick out I kind of just stop and it's hard for me to smoothly get around the pole in time without immediately bending my legs behind me around the pole to speed me up. My instructor told me I need to be able to touch my feet together out in front of me when I kick out, but I've been practicing doing that and I think there is something else wrong. I am also trying to keep my hips up, but without bending my legs as soon as I kick in order to keep the momentum going into the spin, it feels impossible. I thought maybe the problem was that I was sending my body in a line too far forward rather than swinging around the pole in a circle, but I tried correcting that and didn't get anywhere. Any advice?

14 replies

chemgoddess1 · 5/9/2011
The way a lot of people learn this is from a one handed chair. Forget about kicking out and everything until you get the mechanics of this move. In the one handed chair let your body come around to the front of the pole before you reach around and grab the pole behind you. Once you get that down then start working on getting air. Do you have Veena's lessons? I know this is in one of them.
dustbunny · 5/9/2011
I started out learning this move all wrong, it's a small adjustment but it made all the difference. I was kicking out with the inside leg and I couldn't get it, saw in V's lessons that she pushes off with the inside leg. When I made the switch, good things happened! :) Also try it from the chair, it allows you to just feel the move rather than thinking about legs, kiching, and momentum. It just makes it simpler.
Mary Ellyn · 5/9/2011
Starting with the chair can help adapt to the one-handed grip needed for this spin as well as allowing the body to naturally rotate around the pole so that it comes up behind you. Once you get this down and understand the mechanics which include as mentioned, stepping off with the inside foot, learn to sweep the outside leg in a wide circle. A common mistake is that dancers reach back to grab the pole too quickly and wind up with eht second arm bent at the elbow, wrapping around the pole and the pole behind their back. The second arm should not grab until the last minute when the body/shoulders have completely come around and past the pole. A big tip to acheive this is to not grab so high with your lead hand but to grab lower on the pole. This can be intimidating until you have become really comfortable with your one-handed grip.
Mary Ellyn · 5/9/2011
Forgot to add... in addtition to grabbing low, walk further from the pole so that your body is already out and away when you launch into your spin. It's much more difficult to PUSH your body out than to start far from the pole and allow it to float back in.
amy · 5/9/2011
concentrate on projecting your momentum OUT, not AROUND the pole-- the AROUND happens naturally if you keep your hand tight on the pole. i would agree with working on having a very big, airy chair spin before you work on RG-- by big and airy i mean one handed, strong engagement in the scapula/shoulder of the inside arm, and be able to maintain the distance of a foot or so between your hips and the pole as you spin-- LOTS OF AIR! that way you know you have the momentum and swing mechanics solid... step as far forward and OUT from the pole as possible with your inside foot-- i tell people to aim for 5' away if they are comfortable iwth their hand grip-- and sweep your outside leg out and forward, NOT around. this is an old vid (and i was really working on keeping the inside shoulder engaged, so i'm "bouncing" as i pull down on that arm) but you can get a sense of how far to step out to get real oomph. https://www.studioveena.com/videos/view/e0920ae6-bc8a-11df-856f-001b214581be
Mary Ellyn · 5/9/2011
Amy...I noticed you disagreed with my tip to sweep the outside leg around but to instead kick it forward. Maybe this isn't what you mean but if you kick the outside leg straight forward you will create a pendulum effect and your body will slam straight back - sometimes into the pole. Your body is suppose to be moving AROUND the pole so your body will follow the direction of the lead leg. Kick it straight and you come straight out and straight back...sweep it around and your body will follow with a nice circular motion. Maybe I misunderstood since even your video shows you sweeping your leg around and not straight out?
LiveOnceMuseFitness · 5/9/2011
I have a tutorial on youtube for it. You need to start with the one handed chair, but then as you become stronger, your spin should be led with your hips, not your legs - you need to use your hips to throw your legs (like as if you were whipping a towel). Check the video out here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a85UEYjm_2s
Veena · 5/9/2011
I also teach you to lead with the hips..... using an entry from the chair position will not give you as much stretch around the pole and you'll end up with your back touching the pole and slowing you down. But the chair can be a good starting point. I demonstrate both entries here. For those taking the lessons. https://www.studioveena.com/lessons/view/15f92884-b909-11df-856f-001b214581be
LiveOnceMuseFitness · 5/9/2011
I agree with Veena that the chair doesnt give much momentum, but is a safe way to learn as the muscles around the shoulders need to strengthen over time to really kick into this one. It is really easy to damage your shoulder girdle if you try to kick out too far too soon.
HannahElizabeth · 5/9/2011
sorry to repeat this if someone has already mentioned it, but when I was first learning the reverse grab I found twisting your body back towards to pole slightly and arching your back when you're going back in to grab the pole after you've swung round helped keep the momentum. Also trying to master each part of the move then putting hem all together afterwards, so I practiced the initial 'swing' and tried to master that before going in for the 'grab'
Mary Ellyn · 5/9/2011
The sweep of the lead leg is gentle. I don't usually teach from the chair but I will use it once in a while as it just works better for some students. In actuality we teach a grounded version before we ever let them try taking their legs off the ground. Another point of explaining "leading with the hips" which I use, is to say that your hips have to be forward and past the pole before you sweep with the outside leg. if you explain in terms of a clock, you should lead at the 10 or 11 o'clock position, not at the 7 o'clock position. Many will try to step off too soon in this way.
amy · 5/9/2011
empy, i said sweep your outside leg out and forward, NOT around.... and that's exactly what i meant! if you are projecting your body diagonally away from teh pole both out AND forward, and not just running forward and kicking forward, you will sweep around in a natural arc and not like a pendulum. the key is not to kick-- but sweep-- and keep in mind the trajectory of an object tied to a string as the motion to mimic with your momentum. this may be too geometry-related but the line of your outside leg sound be a tangent to the circle of the path of your body, not bisecting the circle.
LittleC · 5/9/2011
Haha Amy - I saw the word "geometry" and started sweating. But 10th grade geometry reared it's ugly head and that is a perfect way to describe it!
nymphdancer · 5/9/2011
this was one of my trouble moves but I finally nailed it Friday!!!! YAY! I actually learned it years ago at one of the few lessons I ever took before last year. I did it but not well and when I got home my brain kept telling me my shoulder that I have dislocated 3 times could not hold my body like that. Having a slippery stainless steel pole didn't help either. Friday karol asked about doing them and I was like nope not a move I can do, she said let me see you try. I tried a volia there it was! yay! I think in part it is because of all the jillian and hammock work making me stronger :)