To lift, or not to lift...

sarabethers started this discussion · 12/4/2012

Hi All, I've been lurking for a while, thought I'd join and start chatting! Anyway, I see a lot of info about girls not wanting to be 'bulky' and 'muscular'...my question is sort of along those lines.. I have a considerable amount of muscle for my short frame (5'1). I find that some of my moves don't look so pretty because of my short pegs, not to mention the layer of fat covering my muscle. Is pole enough, strength-training wise? If I do cardio and eat better, do I lean out or do I need to lift weights along with it? And in addition, what do the pros do? I'm assuming their ripped physiques is a result of practicing hours per day, but do they follow strict diets? Do they do other exercises to stay lean?

31 replies

JeHanne · 12/4/2012
Hi there! Every person is going to have their own way of working out and eating that they swear by. It also normally changes throughout the years depending on ones time allowance, budget, personal goals, health status and energy levels etc. My personal experience is that pole is a killer upper body workout. Pole holds, climbs, spins and moves give me me plenty of upper body work. The only additional upper body work that I do is push ups. I love pole and I don't like anything else so that is another factor. I am motivated to do pole. I have gotten muscle definition in my arms/shoulders/back and love it. My friends tell me I have "guns" now and after years of being a gym rat... I didn't have "guns"... ;) I bet you look great right now just as you are. I understand though the desire to improve/explore and kudos to you for looking for some ideas to help you on that journey. I hope you get lots of great advice in this thread and welcome to SV!
sarabethers · 12/4/2012
Thanks JeHanne, I guess it all boils down to being able to do some cool stuff but not feeling comfortable in how I look when I do it! Eating better is probably the place to start...easier said than done. :)
JeHanne · 12/4/2012
Welcome. Eating better is a great place to start... I have challenges with that one myself. :)
Anastasiakowa · 12/5/2012
About legs...Try wearing stilettos:) That would make them look much longer, and the moves overall will look much sexier) I watched an interview with Felix Cane ( i personally think she is great), and even she doesnt like being "very short" and always does pole in stilettos:) Well maybe while you are learning you can do it barefoot, but when trying to put the moves together you can try wearing them.... When I put heels on I feel a lot more confident about my moves, so, maybe this can help somehow) Also I just started recently and do pushups and abs exercises, and I dont think it is bad to get some muscle:) Layer of fat, i understand, may make some parts of the body look bigger as the muscle grows, but I believe as you get better and get used to the pole you will lose good amount of weight so its just a matter of time. I have same issues about my legs looking bigger with layer of fat on top of muscle, but I just tell myself its fine for now, and that it gives me more grip😀 But im planning to shed that eventually as I spend more time practicing with a pole. Dont lose your motivation😉
BeccaBuck · 12/5/2012
i second the suggestion to wear heels, to make your legs look longer! it really does create the illusion of really long legs. if you're trying to change the appearance of your body, your food intake is crucial. You'll only get partial results if you're working out, but ignoring how/what you eat. that said, I wouldn't get too caught up in the way your body looks. if you're healthy and fit, then you're perfect just the way you are!
sarabethers · 12/5/2012
Part of my motivation is to make it easier to haul my ass up the pole, too! I guess I just need to be consistent with the diet.
Hazelnut · 12/6/2012
I think pole doesn't burn that much fat in the same way a purely cardio workout does. But it's way more fun ;) I think eating well is most important, personally. I try to think of it like I need to eat well to fuel my body so I can achieve my best in pole, and to avoid long term health issues (diabetes, heart disease and cancer all run in my family). So when I need to motivate myself I try not to think about the "skinny" factor or losing weight or how I look, because they're all things that you don't see changes in quickly, and can depend so much on so many things. I tell myself I'm doing this for all the other benefits that you can't see, and that helps me stick to a healthy eating plan when I'd rather just reach for the KFC!!
aliceBheartless · 12/6/2012
I think that if you like weightlifting go for it! I used to train weightlifting a lot (4-5 times a week) during high school and college, long before I even was a poler, and I really liked it. Bonus: with all that lifting, most of which was Olympic technique, I never "bulked up". Proper lifting technique can be tricky though, so definitely make sure you have a spot, even just to correct alignment, etc, otherwise your hard work will never show good results and you might train in some injuries/imbalances. If I had to guess, I would say that the pros probably train a lot (not just teach, but their own specific training times, which likely includes endurance work and conditioning work on the pole and off) and eat clean etc. Have to do both. As with anything, you just have to decide how much you want to put in. I think cardio and weight training can benefit pole. And weighttraining can be really good for fat burn long term. Building muscle requires your body to maintain that muscle. Which comes downo to eating properly.
abcollins1 · 12/6/2012
Women do not get "bulky" from weight training. When people use the word "bulky" what they are referring to is the fat over the muscle that they have. Im willing to bet you dont have as much muscle as you think you do. Most people overestimate the amount of muscle they have, and under estimate the amount of fat. And truthfully, unless you have actually spent a lot of time studying female fat precentages and patterns, you are not going to have a good grasp of what type of physique is under the fat. Trust me on this, its not a knock on you or anyone, but its reality that people do not understand and why people think its "easy" to change their body composition when it is not. Leaning out comes down to diet and being in a calorie deficit, and weight training will help you keep what muscle you have. Muscle is hard to build so you do want to keep what you have. Losing weight is easy, losing fat is pretty hard and takes a lot of time and attention to details. The pros do have strict diets and it all comes down to calories and manipulating fats, carbs, and proteins. I have been weight trainign for years and managed to put on some good muscle, im shorter than you and still not bulky. My very good friend is exactly your height and has been weight training for almost 18 years and is still not "bulky"
aliceBheartless · 12/13/2012
Great info abcollins! This sort of stuff fascinates me. Definitely agree about how I completely underestimate fat and overestimate muscles, I think I always have. And I put "bulked up" in quotes, because anytime I say it, I am being snarky. :) I have NEVER met a woman who was lifting olympic weights 4-5 times a week (which is fairly intense for training on one's own for amateur pursuits) who bulked up with muscle mass. It just doesn't happen. What I do see, is people rewarding hard weightlifting workouts with heavy protein shakes and/or unhealthy meals, because they feel feel like they worked hard enough that the calories are accounted for in the workout. This was the biggest mistake I saw with people who lifted. Or trained anything hardcore. Because not eating healthy will bulk you up, but it's not with muscle.
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
Maybe I should provide some info that will help-- I'm a former college athlete, I was olympic-caliber (meaning I was invited to try out and didn't make the cut). I have years of heavy, Olympic-style lifting under my belt, and a body-type (short muscle attachments, high proportion of Type II muscle fibers) that responds well to any type of resistance exercise. I DO have a layer of fat over my muscles now that gives me a thick look, but I do have a higher than normal proportion of muscle underneath it, too. What I'm concerned about are the lines and look of my body when I pole dance. If I can use this as a 'strength' workout, and focus on my diet/adding some HIIT or other cardio, I think I would lose fat and create a leaner look. But I wonder if it's enough?
aliceBheartless · 12/13/2012
Well, what does 'enough' mean to you? Is it about getting to a specific look, ie a ballet dancer's or bikini comp physique? Or is it more functional in nature to you, ie gaining enough strength to do an iron cross? I have the hardest time reconciling to myself that the look I want for myself is likely nothing that will be gained through lifting/training (mostly because I am still getting ok with myself and my genes). However, with lifting and training, I can get the strength required for pole skills, which will also change how my body looks, for the better since I like the strong look. Also, for me its about the journey, as trite as that sounds. Because there are only so many things I am willing to do, and for me, pole should always be fun.
abcollins1 · 12/13/2012
If you were a previous lifter than before, you should have some muscle under the fat, however, oly lifters typically dont do low body fat as you would need the strenght and going too low in bodt fat would sacrifice strength, So unless you have done a few bulk/cut cycles, you dont know what you have built ( and no one knows how much muscle they have managed to build until they go low in bodyfat, not even bodybuilders). So again, you are still over estimating muscle and undersestimating fat. Losing fat goes back to diet, not what kind of exercise or training you do. If your diet is in check, then you will lose fat. Doing pole wont automatically make you lose fat. Doing Hiit wont automatically lose fat. Lifitng weight doent utomaticaly make you lose fat. This is what I do for a living, poling is a hobby, bodybuilding is a hobby, but my job is to help people lose fat and gain strength. Balance out calories and protein, fats, and carbs and any animal will lose weight. The science is the same.
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
Well with my muscle comes a lot of natural strength----I can do flagpole, iron cross, most strength things fairly easily, it's just the flexibility issues with extra muscle AND fat (upper back, etc.) that concerns me. I'm more into the Jenyne B look, but I know my body has limits.
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
I have done a figure competition. I know how much bulk I have naturally. I am pretty thick right now and I still have visible abdominal muscles.
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
I've also done a Bod Pod, and at the time I was around the same thickness as I am now, and I was at 19% body fat, with nearly 100 pounds of lean muscle (estimated).
abcollins1 · 12/13/2012
If youve done figure competitions then you should know the diet is the key to losing fat, not how you train. If your 5'1 and 19% at 100 pounds, then thats not a lot of muscle my friend. at 5'1 and a lot of muscle you should be 115 - 120 at 19%, stage weight of 105 - 110 at 15% that would mean you would be maybe 95 lbs at stage weight. It makes no sense. Even the smallest bikini girls are 98 lbs at 16%
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
No, I wasn't 100 pounds, I was 120, with 19% body fat and nearly 100 pounds lean mass..
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
At my leanest (when I was not healthy looking) I wasa 106. I had very little body fat. Now I'm closer to 120 again, and I'm looking for the happy medium.
abcollins1 · 12/13/2012
i would love to see pics of this.
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
I'll have to look at photobucket (when I'm not at work, hehe). I'm not BSing you, I do have a very gymastics-like body type. When I was 106, I was not healthy by any means. I had no strength, I was not eating enough. I don't want to go that far, because it takes some food to maintain strength and not just fall off the pole..if I wanted to drop kcals at this point I'd need to go to about 1200-1400 per day, and that's hard for me. I guess that's the only real answer, anyway.
abcollins1 · 12/13/2012
I find it hard to believe because you are telling me that you have more muscle mass than someone who has been bodybuilding for 18 years and has one of the top figures in the world. Someone whos stage weight is 110 at 14% bodyfat, who qualified for the junior nationals in their first show and has placed top 3 in international competitions. I highly doubt you have to drop to 1200 cals immeditely, even i dont go that low and im shorter and weigh less than you.
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
I'm just going based on what I'd have to eat to lose 1lb a week. I'm not saying I have a great body by any means. Or I wouldn't be asking. I definitely am not trying to be difficult, my physique is nowhere comparable to a figure competitors at its current state, I am only using the stats I received from the bod pod many years ago. It's possible as I have aged I have lost some muscle mass. I am just trying to figure out if I just do pole if it's enough to maintain the mass I have now and drop weight rather than lose more muscle than necessary when losing the weight.
sarabethers · 12/13/2012
I completely agree with you, and I'm on no way trying to say you are wrong or be difficult about this. I didn't mean for this to get to this point, because i do understand that the myth of bulk really lies more in the subcutaneous fat stores than the muscle mass itself.
abcollins1 · 12/13/2012
I think poling is super great for the upper body, but for the legs, you are going to need more if you plan on maintaing mass or building. Personally I pole 3 days a week and weight train 4, plus teach my spin classes weekly. Ive been able to maintain my weight but cals are high, protein at 120g a day. If its been some years since you have been lifting regularly and had those stats, then your body will have changed, so agian you are still looking at taking off the fat to see what is left. Youre at an advatage from lots of people in that you should still have a nice base to cut down and see what you got. I would not advise immedietly dropping to 1400 cals to drop weight. I would drop 300 cals from what you are eating now, add lifitng in and cardio for another 200 - 300 cal burn. If you are not sure what you are eating now, then journal for a few days and see. But protein should be high, moderate fats and fill the rest in with carbs (healthy ones :) )

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