Dwiizie started this discussion ·
Why do we say two sets of 10 reps, instead of just 20 reps? I don't understand, especially if doing sets back to back, its just 20 reps. Can someone chime in on why its broken up that way? Thanks!
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Veena ·
You DO take a break between reps when there are multiple sets. Otherwise it would just say 20 reps. It's also nice to change things up a bit and forgo sets and just do high reps. Multiple sets come in handy when you're new the strength training or lifting very heavy weight as well.
When you are lifting you should choose a weight that will be difficult for you to do 10 reps of. Once getting out 10-12 reps becomes easy you should up the weight. There are also set up where you max weight on the first set and then continually drop the weight for the subsequent sets. If you can pop out 20 reps of something then you really should be changing it up some way to make it harder.
Dwiizie ·
Whats the advantage to a break between a set, to move to a set of other movements and come back, or just rest and start a new set of the same thing, or it doesn't matter it just means to break it up...
It depends on what your goals are. I know people who will jump rope or do jumping jacks or even burpees between sets. Sometimes it is just to give your body a short recovery, or even to breathe properly and get some oxygen to the system.
Dwiizie ·
I guess I'd ask next, is it BAD if you don't break it up? I totally get what you're saying with "if you're doing 20 reps without effort, more weight needed etc" but what if you do the most reps possible at your heaviest repable weight, and only pop out 5-12... is that a bad technique for strength? I ask because recently I was using a program that advocated minimal reps on max weight rather than sets or switching or breaks. It DOES call to do cardio like jump rope before moving to the next muscle group, circuit training style, but you never go back to, say, bicep curls, if you did 8 of them with 20lb weights, as opposed to 2 sets of 10 with 8 lb weights...
Saphyre ·
I agree with Chem. It depends on what your golas are. The general thought is that if you do less reps with heavier weights, you can potentially build more muscle in a "bulk up" sense. I have worked with personal trainers a lot throughout my life, and I have to say that I have never heard of only doing one set of anything. If less weight is used, then you usual circuit train. Example: 1 set of Biceps, then 1 set of Back, then 1 set of jump rope. Then you start Set 2 of each exercise, and follow with a third set. I cannot see where only doing 1 set, no matter the weight or number of reps, would really do much for you unless you do multiple versions of working on the same muscle.
Dwiizie ·
I think the logic behind it was "max out your muscles to build muscles, take 20 reps to do it with sets and lighter weights, or kill them in 5 reps with heavier weight and move to next muscle" Going with the whole "lift til you can lift no more" mentality. Either way, after hearing from you guys, I'm thinking maybe its just a screwy "get buff quick" type fitness approach. Appreciate the weigh ins!
litlbit ·
There are a few types of weight training. Wt training with sets, circuit, and Failure. Failure is pushing yourself on an exercise until you can no longer do it with good form or control, in other words you've pushed your muscle to the point of failure. This method is used by allot of bodybuilders, and allot of them believe it is the best way to train. When I do lift, it's to failure, it has worked the best for me as I don't lift often, just when I cant get in a good pole work out because I don't have time with teaching and running my business. Here's soe basic info. Positive Failure When you can no longer push or pull a weight to full extension you have reached positive failure. This is the concentric portion of the lift, in which the agonists, the prime muscular movers in the lift, are contracting. In a bench press, for example, the chest, shoulders and triceps are the agonists -- they contract as you push the bar from your chest to full extension. When you cannot do this, you have reached positive failure. When doing an exercise such as the barbell row, positive failure occurs when you can no longer pull the bar completely in to your body. Negative Failure. Negative failure is when you can no longer control the weight during any portion of the lift under your own power. This is when even the eccentric, or lengthening aspect of the exercise, cannot be completed. Using the bench press example, when you can no longer lower the weight to your chest under control -- or if when rowing you can no longer lower the bar to full extension and would wind up dropping it -- you have reached negative failure. Using Failure At first, train only to technical failure. As you become more proficient, you can train to positive failure or very close to it with every workout. Training to negative failure is a considerable drain on your recovery ability, as you cause additional microtrauma, or damage to small structures within your muscles, that requires longer recovery time. Training to negative failure must be used sparingly, and safely as well. Read more: http://www.livestrong.com/article/354095-what-are-failure-reps/#ixzz2GqGnK3Gg
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You have put forth an excellent explanation of what I was trying to say when describing the method as opposed to a sets method. So you like that and use it. I've done kind of a mix by working until positive failure, but by using mediumish weights, so failure doesn't come in 7 reps, it comes at 12, then 15, then 17, then when I get to 20, I go up a weight and start with low rep again. But no sets, no breaks. Its like I'm not being effective at either technique. I will say that for certain things, like a pole row, you're using body weight resistance, so upping the reps and sets is your only way to continue to reach failure until there is no failure at 10 sets of 12, and you can't add to body weight. You can change angles to present challenges, but it seems theres a roof on it. Hrm...
Dwiizie ·
*I meant 3 sets of 12 lol
litlbit ·
I started at lighter wts, but increase each wo. I max out failure at anywhere from 4-7 reps depending on the day. Failure works best with higher wts preventing you from doing higher reps, that's the whole point, to push yourself to increase muscle. It works best for me because I have more recovery time in between lifting since I don't lift on a regular bass as I stated earlier. ex. my last DB chest bench press I maxed to failure with 35lbs at 6 reps.
litlbit ·
OOPS!! I meant basis!! LOL
Dwiizie ·
And I typically do strength training 3 times a week, a day in between for recovery, a day off. So thats why I was sticking to the reps and things, though failure seems to come more naturally to me as a method, s I was still failing myself out 3 times a week WITH reps. I'm glad to know someone else has heard of it, when V and Chem and Saph came in with their thoughts I was like "Maybe I'm just imagining things or misinterpreting something..."
litlbit ·
Veena is right regarding sets, if you are doing 3-4 sets of regular wt training you rest up to 3 minutes in between, if you do circuits you don't rest, however they are set up to work a different muscle so the muscle you just stressed gets a break. Example, doing a chest 1st, then something cardio, then legs, then triceps. The order is important for circuit. You need to know your muscle groups. :)
Dwiizie ·
Got it :) Thank you!
Check out: www.poleathlete.com and click on "pole strength." He has some good articles on there. Also one good thing to remember is that you are only strengthening or not-strengthening a muscle. There is no such thing as "toning." You need to fatigue a muscle in about 60 seconds (10-12 reps). Otherwise, if you are doing alot of reps you are increasing muscle endurance and NOT muscle strength.
litlbit ·
Veena is also an excellent resource, she has been a personal trainer for several years! Which is why her lessons, including conditioning, strength training etc, are so thourough.
This is all basiclly about one topic that has been popular lately, and that is programming. Everything begins with the goal, why are you training and what are you training for. Of course most people here will say "pole" but thats not quite it. You need to know what the overall goal of the progran is: strength, mass, endurance, all three, or something else entirely??? The type of training is going to follow whatever your goal is, and this will also determine sets, reps, rest, and exercise choice. But everything in the program needs to have a reason. You dont throw in sets, reps or exercises arbitrarily. Another point that i am seeing talked around but not named is progression. Whatever program you have should have progression built in. And that means that if you have say 2 sets of 10 reps, you not only have a reason for choosing that, but have a plan on how to change that when that is too easy, adding weight is good, but then you need to look at why you are adding weight and does that fit in with the goal or do you need to change something else. There is a lot that goes into building an exercise program, wether its strength training or cardio or whatever. Not all exercises need to go to faliure, not all exercises benefit from higher weights. Personally I work out and design programs with a variety of sets and reps for a variety of reasons. rests periods are going to affect a lot of things as well, shorter rests will help make a session more intense by shortening recovery time, longer rests can help "dissolve" lactic acid build up in the muscle and give more recovery, usually seen when moving the higher weights. However there is no "set" time limit for rests, it may vary individually. Again, though its going to depend on the goal of the program. As always, if you cant do it with good form, you need to drop the weight regradless of anything else. I think veenas lessons here are very good in that she shows and explains the begginer, intermediate and advanced postitions in many things and the site has a natural progression into it.
The basic reason for why people say 2 sets of 10 instead of just 20 is because your body needs time to recover. If you are doing just 20 reps you are working more endurance not strength.. you will become stronger eventually and also depending or where you are starting from but this way is not the most efficient way. If your main goal is to build strength you should hae a minute or 2 break between each set..... that's why you see the big dudes in the gym that look like their walking around more than actually working out Now you don't have to just sit around for your rest... like someone else said adding cardio between sets such as jumping rope or jogging in place or jumping jacks will keep your heart rate up and has been shown to be a good way to burn fat......... another way to optimize your workout would be to do an upper body exercise and then do a lower body one.... so your upper body muscles are resting while your working lower and vice versa Also.... some exercises are ment to be done in lots of reps...... such as core and shoulder stabilizers...... with these areas you want light weight and slow controled movements Its a whole lot of exercise science..... if you really want an indepth answer to your questions I would recommend contacting and qualified personal trainer or strength coach
