Reducing fat but keeping muscle... While being vegetarian :S

Prilladonna started this discussion · 12/20/2012

Hello to all of you lovely ladies and boys out there! Well, in a few days it is time to make new years resolutions and all, and since I am very proud of myyself and my development over the year strength wise and flexibility wise, I think that I will have to focus on slimming down. The problem is that I would not want that to happen at the expence of reduced muscle/strenght since I have been working hard to get to where I am now.. And I would not like to have it interfere with my exercise.. And I am a vegetarian, but a "light" vegetarian, meaning I don't eat red meat. I don't eat chicken more than once or twice a month, and I eat fish maby three times a week. Any tips would do it, so that I can think about it for a few more days or so an figure out how to go about it. Thank you very much!

29 replies

chemgoddess1 · 12/20/2012
Do you have any idea what your body fat content is right now? What specifically are your goals? Are those goals realistic? The question that you posed is really broad and without having some initial information about what you feel slimming down and reducing body fat means this is difficult to answer. There was just a good thread about a week ago with lots of information regarding body perceptions and body fat. I might suggest reading through that first: https://www.studioveena.com/forums/view/Lower_Abdominal_Exercises_20121210075628 And I don't recognize your screen name so I assume you are fairly new, so WELCOME!
Dancing Paws · 12/20/2012
There is plenty of protein in beans, quinoa, chia seeds, in addition to other foods, so if you eat properly you should not lost muscle.
MissMeliss · 12/21/2012
Don't take this the wrong way, but please don't call yourself vegetarian, when you're not. Just state that you don't eat red meat. It makes it SO hard and confusing to others who think then that all 'vegetarians' eat chicken, or fish, and in some cases, red meat occasionally. So then for eg. if I am to attend a barbeque where I'm told vegetarians will be catered for, and I'm then given chicken or fish.. It's rather embarassing and awkward on both sides to have to explain that that ISN'T vegetarian. Not to mention, I (and other vegeo's in the same boat) would go hungry. That aside... Google vegetarian recipes, there are millions. Cut back on pasta and cheeses- particularly 'yellow' cheese.Opt for more fetta, ricotta styles, and if you can, goats milk cheeses are better. (Note- not all cheeses are vegetarian, if they contain rennet, they aren't vegetarian. Rennet is calves stomach/lining). Up your intake of grains, svelt is great, as is quinoa and they both have a fairly high level of protein in them. Plenty of dark green vegies, they're you're best friends! Bananas are ace, too. You can get svelt wraps (amongst many other kinds) which are better than bread, so grab those and stuff with vegies, beans legumes etc.
monica kay · 12/21/2012
do you mean "spelt"? :) your body will become "svelt" when you eat "spelt"
MissMeliss · 12/21/2012
Hahaha oh my, how remiss of me. Yes, spelt! Pronounced 'svelt'. I had a big night last night.. :S
michaelaarghh · 12/23/2012
Agree with MissMeliss re: vegetarianism (even thouhg I'm personally not - I have plenty of friends who struggle with people misunderstanding). Can I ask why you don't eat red meat?
Prilladonna · 12/23/2012
Thnk u everyone! :) Well, I m pretty helthy and do train lot, a vary the exercise I take quite well. I have a scle that should measure the amount of body fat I have, and acording to it I have a precentage of approx 35%, and that is a lot. But I do also have a lot of muscle, and look as heavy as I actually am :/ I am what you would say a ft but fit person :P so, I should have a good starting piont if I would like to decrease in fat percentage :) I ate red meat until the age of 19, and then I moved back to my mother, and she was then a vegetarian, the kind tht eat eggs and dairy products. And since she cocked the food, I became a vegetarian. Or at least most of my food was. And then I lost some weight :) I was as well really tired of red meat, since I had been working extra t McDonald's while getting my high-school education... The kind of meat that I ate back then was mostly half-fabricats (could you say so in english?), or processed, half-coocked stuff an really not that healthy :/ So one day I simply made a decission to stop with red meat as well a white meat, except for fish, cause i have always liked fish. And I'm sorry for missleading you about the vegetarianism, but at least in Sweden we do differentate more about being vegetarian, most of the people calling themselves vegetarians eat fish. It's called different things dependign on what you eat, for example a lakto-ovo-vegetarian eat dairy and eggs, while a lakto-vegetarian eat dairy. So, everytime I say I am a vegatarian, I also have to explain whitch type, but at least I don't end up with a hamburger , lol :P But the thing is that I do eat chicken once in a while, and I started for about four years ago when I started lifting weights. I found that I really wanted to eat chiken back then, an I thought that it was my body telling me something. So I do eat is sometimes, but do not want to eat it to often, cause it makes me feel "heavy". It's like I only need it when I have been training heavily. Except for that, there are environmental reasons for not eating meat, as well as how the animals are treated in animal farms, an if I don't have a real reason to eat it, I am only happy to give it up. I don't like it. Now I will go find out what spelt is in swedish :P And thank you chemgoddess, I will check the thread out! :)
beginner2 · 12/23/2012
Pretty much depends on how you feel after you eat. Each person is different. Some must eat whole bread and brown rice. Some only eat raw, mainly fruits. We often feel we need to eat some certain foods because the doctors and advertisements say so. If you don't eat and drink anything from animals/fish/shrimps...., you are a vegan. Some people take tofu for protein intake but some people are against tofu. They say it is mostly made from gmo soy beans and is bad. Vegetarians eat eggs, fish and drink milk. When I cut out all the meats, milk, butter and cheese, I feel cleaner and lighter. I also see the change in taste that I require minimal cooking ingredients. This pix says about taste. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=268701776563326&set=pb.131369396963232.-2207520000.1356278369&type=3&theater I know the author does not mind the taste but just wants to keep her muscles. So at this point I guess you can make use of the protein previous posters said but for beans, they say you only need one cup a day. This man is a vegan too and he has muscles http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QXuQscrG8-U
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beginner2 · 12/23/2012
That same person in the video said Don't buy into the common believe that you need tons of protein to build muscle. That is simply a myth. First of all you need proper training in order to induce muscle growth. Then you have to feed your body with the nutrients it really needs in order to build muscle. And this is not only protein, this is also Vitamins, Minerals, Enzyms and more. Meat and Dairy are very poor when it comes to those vital substances since they are destroyed by heat (cooking). Not to mention the unhealhty fatty acids in animal products that lead directly to fat gains!
michaelaarghh · 12/23/2012
Definitely agree with the fact that you need to approach eating in a wholistic manner - it's not just protein you want, but all the vitamins, minerals and enzymes. But beginner2, you're wrong when you say meat and dairy are poor when it comes to those - heating does not destroy minerals and meat is one of the most nutritionally dense foods you can eat. Also - speaking of myths: eating fat does not make you fat. Fat is actually really healthy for you, and the myth of saturated fat is one of the biggest ones we've all been mislead by. There is not one scientific, peer-reviewed study that says that eating saturated fat leads to higher cholesterol or weight gain or unhealthy consequences. (Forigve me, it's 5:30 in the morning here, but I'll come back later with scientific sources)
Prilladonna · 12/23/2012
@beginner2: Thanx for the reply! I love to discus proper diet! It's also hard to know what diet tips that will do it for me, or for anyone at all, since different studies imply different things... So I think I will do whatever feels best atm :) but I totally agree with you, it is not the meat that tastes good, it is the seasoning.. I couldn't open the youtube link, but found it anyhow :) sounds relly cool! Will def check it out! Unfortunately, I have found that I do increase muscle, and and are able to shorten my resting period between training sessions if I drink protein shakes (whey). I also tend to eat less if I consume a protein shake a day, due to feeling satisfied. I reed somewhere that what's your "optimal" food depends on your genes, some are better at processing protein than others, and some are better at processing carbs, and there is of course those that are in between. I personally feel fuller on protein, but also heavier. And that is a welcomed feeling in intense periods of training. I once tried a raw food detox diet, and went on it for three months. During those months, at least my sister said that I lost weight, but the problem was that when I started eating as usual, I had lost a lot of muscle, and I gaind a lot of fat due to not having the same energy requirments (muscle burn seven times more than fat...). And then I read somewhere that it's actually so that the body can't take up all the vitamins in raw food, so that it's better from a vitamin perspective to eat cocked food... And then I kind of gave up.. I'm not sure what to think, and probably even the scientists are arguing about it, lol. So I mix both coocked and uncoocked greens, with focus on coocked ones during winter and uncoocked during summer. But I would love to read arguments for both sides, if anyone feels like they are up for it :)
panacotta · 12/23/2012
I am sorry to point that again but the sentence "Vegetarians eat eggs, fish and drink milk." is not true. Just checxkt the definition Vegetarianism is the practice of abstaining from consumption of meat. Fish or sea food is meat (it is clearly not a plant if you'd asked me), it is really simple if you ask me ! especially if you put it another way: vegetarians don't eat animals, if something is or was an animal, vegetarian won't eat it. another thing is, you need a lot of protein if you don't want to loose muscle tissue, although you need carbs and fat as well. carbs are essencial to burn fat tissue in your body. I, when trying to reduce my body fat, used to eat around 120g of protein, 150g carbs (good ones) and 60-70g of fat, it was 1600-1700 kcal total. To maitain my body weight I was suppose to eat 2000- 2100 kcal, so 1700 was reasonable cut. I did partly succeed, not totally as it was really a bad time in my life to start diet, I am planning to try again in march and then after reduction, try to gain more muscle. I am 162 or something cm tall and I weight 48-50kg, which means I am rather tiny but more in 'skinnyfat' way which I do not 100 per cent like. I highly reccomend you 'good calorie, bad calorie' book, it's worth the read!
Dancing Paws · 12/23/2012
Overall, it is better to avoid animal products, i.e. meat, eggs, dairy. They are the only fod source of cholesterol, but you make your own choleserol so you don't need more. Milk can interefere withyour calcium absorption, as can spinach. You can get all your necessary fats from plants. Hemp, chia, and flax have wayyyyyy more omoega 3s than fish. Avocdos have lots of good fats, so do coconut products. do some online searching about vegan nutrition.
megan12 · 12/23/2012
I'll play devil's advocate. Hear me out, okay? lol. Your body fat percentage is normal, but on the high side. That tells me your current diet is not working for you, especially if you are getting enough exercise (which is sounds like you are from your initial post). Why don't you eat what you normally eat for a week and keep a food journal? It'll give you some clues about what you can improve upon. My guess is that you are probably eating too many carbs. This a problem that I think plagues a fair number of vegetarians. I could be wrong because I am not vegetarian but fruits and vegetables don't have that many calories so you're never filling up your tank, so to speak. So to meet your energy needs, one must turn to carbs since it is more difficult to eat protein from non-animal sources. Some people just don't do well with carbs and it leads to weight gain. You can't build muscle if you don't have enough protein, simple as that. More muscle leads to a higher metabolism, which can help with weight loss. Quinoa has 18 grams of protein per serving, beans, nuts, and soy also have lots of protein. The fact of the matter is, not every diet is right for everyone.
abcollins1 · 12/23/2012
I see a lot of good information here, but there are some things that concern me. Protein, in order to build and maintain muscle, you do need to eat a certain amount of protein in your diet, it is one of the most important things you need, and this is based on the science of how the body works. Without sufficent protein in the diet, your body will break down the most abundant source of protien in the body, which is the muscles. This usually happens when someone begins a "diet" and doesnot provide enough protein to the body. If you would like all of the actual science stuff.... http://scidiv.bellevuecollege.edu/rkr/biology160/lectures/pdfs/Respiration160.pdf The other part i would like to add is that, animal products do not by themselves add a significant amount of cholesteral to the diet. Dietary cholesteral is only about 4% of total cholesteral. I eat eggs everyday and my cholesteral has been described as "beautiful" by my doctor, My numbers are very good and have gone from 158 to 136 in the last 3 years. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11111098 And actually, vegans have the hardest time of all getting healthy fats in their diet and are more at risk of being deficient. I have found no credible proof that either milk or spinach cause problems with calcium absorbtion. In fact my daughters dietician was very concerned about the fact that my daughter could not drink milk, not only because it has lots of protein and calories, but because the calcium was needed for bone health. And yes we have had her on Hemp Protein but her dietician was really not a big fan of it either. http://www.jacn.org/content/19/suppl_2/119S.full
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chemgoddess1 · 12/23/2012
Dietary cholesterol has very little effect on blood cholesterol. What we have been led to believe for so many years is being proved wrong daily.
Dancing Paws · 12/23/2012
btw don't eat soy, it contains estrogen-like compunds. You can be vegetarian and/or vegan and not eat soy.
beginner2 · 12/26/2012
tallicachild, totally agree with you about fat. They lie to us for like 50 years in order to sell the cooking oil. some people now say that fat in pork is not that bad compared with cooking oil. A search will birng up many results about to avoid soy bean oil, sunflower oil, even olive oil. https://www.studioveena.com/users/view/5080f06f-fb98-4962-9434-712d0ac37250, vegans are not short of good fat. they eat avocado, fresh coconut milk, peanuts, sesame and so on.
beginner2 · 12/26/2012
https://www.studioveena.com/users/view/4fba5ee9-ef48-4c57-a255-55e90ac37250, I base on this chart to say about a vegetarian and a vegan. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diet_(nutrition) A vegan takes nothing from animals, no fur, no honey, no leather, no teeth....
michaelaarghh · 12/26/2012
Nope - olive oil is one of the best oils there is, but it oxidises when it heats up, so its best to use peanut oil or coconut oil for cooking. And I'm sorry AerialGypsy but it is NOT best to avoid animal products. Meat contains all the essential amino acids that we need to get, and is low in carbohydrates. Meat is excellent as far as nutrition goes. I suggest watching the documentary 'Fat Head', and reading some books such as 'Why We Get Fat', 'Sugar is Poison', etc etc. Just make sure the sources used in the book are scientific studies and check the motives of the author / filmmaker. Also - just want to raise a point about vegetarianism, and wondering if anyone can help me out here. Fish are one of the most endangered animals that we eat - so why do some 'ethical vegetarians' (actually pescetarians) not eat meat but accept fish? I know that obviously this is not all vegetarians - but if you're one of these peeps can you chime in? Thanks :)
chemgoddess1 · 12/26/2012
How do you consider fish an endangered animal?
Prilladonna · 12/26/2012
Hello again! Well, Tallicachild, I don't eat meat but fish since I like fish but not meat. And as it seams, it helps me eat better. Now I'm eating more vegetables than I was when eating meat, and it cuts out all the "bad" meat that I used to eat. I guess that it depends on why you are a vegetarian, everyone has their own reasons :) @megan12: yep, do know. It gets to me, cause I am the least lazy person I know when it comes to training, but then again I am not the smallest :/ so I try, and struggle to get enough protein since it works better for me, but I don't really want to eat red meat. And I don't eat chicken and fish that much either, and I get tired of eggs sometimes... Maby should try more nuts? Cause I know that I tend to fill up on carbs instead :/ and even though fruit is good for you, maby not the amount that I do eat somedays :P @Aerialgypsy: thanx! Trying to avoid soy! Am really happy that (after a really long time....) almond milk is available in grocery stores! :) Thank you for all tips! :) find it intresting that everyone has thier own way of seing something as basic as eating :) will check out the "Fat Head" ocumentary as well! :)
Dancing Paws · 12/26/2012
Coconut milk is at Walmart! I also like its milk and sunflower seed milk.
Dancing Paws · 12/26/2012
Talla- you get all your essential amino acids from ants too. Simply eating two different plants will go that. The only way to be deficient is if you eat one thing everyday, which nobody does. Quinoa, hemp, chia, etc all are complete proteins. That whole "vegans don't get protein" argument is a load if crap we've been fed by the meat and dairy industry. Try reading eating animals to see what evils go on in that industry. I used to believe all that bs about meat being a wonder food etc, but I've spent years looking into it and, once again, we've been lied to.
Dancing Paws · 12/26/2012
Btw vegans do not load up on sugars and carbs. Veggies, fruit, beans snd nuts are a huge part of the vegan diet. I never see fat vegans. Eating fish is sometimes done be vegs because fish are thought to not feel pain like other sentient brings. It is a matter of preference. Really though, lets not get bogged down in definitions. The only thing you need to be careful with as a veg is getting your b12. I believe it is in nutritional yeast and veg milks are being fortified with it. I also think certain seaweeds have it? I'd check that as I'm not sure...might be in spirulina? But with the original question, you can eat veg and lose weight if you don't load up on carbs like bread and pasta. Eat you veggies!!!

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