Question for Runners

Runemist34 started this discussion · 3/16/2014

Hey everyone! Not pole related exactly, but I know that there MUST be a few runners around here, and I have a question... Just went for my third run, ever, and the outsides of my foot (right foot specifically, from pinky toe to heel) and the outside of my ankle hurt SO FREAKING MUCH! Like, to the point where I just wanted to sit down and cry. So... have you ever experienced this? And if so, how did you fix it? And yes, I have proper running shoes. I made sure to get those before I started.

15 replies

yrngrl · 3/16/2014
That it is bad enough to make you want to cry makes me worry its a stress fracture... :(
yrngrl · 3/16/2014
Also, proper running shoes for you, or just proper running shoes? Depending on your body and how you run, you might have particular needs (for me, I need stability shoes or else I'm in trouble).
Runemist34 · 3/16/2014
Hmm, not sure it could be a stress fracture after literally three times? Those things take a long time to come up, and the pain fades after I stop running. It was suggested over on Facebook that I may be putting too much weight on that part of my foot, but I'm actually prone to rolling inward, due to my knees being jerks. I've been working hard on keeping things straight and level, especially when running. It feels like muscle cramps, if I'm honest, but I don't know how to deal with them at all!
Runemist34 · 3/16/2014
And as for the running shoes... I don't know? I've never run before. Generally I just prefer to work out in barefoot (if I'm at home, poling) or in my climbing shoes (which are HORRIBLE but quite necessary). I asked the person at the store, but... they didn't seem to know much except about whether the shoes were cross-trainers or whatever.
Anzia · 3/16/2014
I run (not well, and not far!) and the three things that come to mind are: 1) Are you starting on short distances, interspersed with walking, and then planning to build up gradually over several weeks? The Couch25k running plan is great for this. If you do too much too soon it stresses your body and leads to pain. 2) Are you having at least one non-running day after each running day? A few years ago I ran every day for four days and hurt my knee so much I had to stop running altogether for 5 weeks. I have some friends who run every day but they generally have more aches and niggles than the friends who run alternate days. 3) Are your running shoes designed to compensate for your particular gait? For example, my feet land slightly on the inside and then 'roll' to the outside as they take off again, so my shoes had to be ones that are shaped/designed to compensate for that otherwise I'd be in pain. A good running shop may have a treadmill where they can film you running and play it back in slow motion to check your running movement, and advise on the right running shoes to keep you comfortable. Right now I'd say consider getting your foot checked by your doctor, and even if there's nothing obvious wrong, rest for at least several weeks before starting again. A too-short rest just leads to any pain coming back. Good luck!
Runemist34 · 3/16/2014
Hey Anzia! I've been running every second day, so letting myself rest in between runs for a day. I don't really do much else right now (working on getting back to poling). I only run about 3k each time, and I can't go the whole distance. I'm seeing marked improvement in my stamina for sure, but each time I go out (which has been three, I'll grant you) it hurts like crazy. As for "compensating for my particular gait," I don't honestly know of any place in my entire town that would test for that. And, due to my knees and their issues, my gait is changing. If I don't use my hips and certain muscles properly, I'll cause myself further damage. Running is new to me, so I'm often paying the most attention to not hurting my knees further, not whatever my feet are doing. I have been considering asking my doctor, though, as I'd like to keep running, but don't want to just have crazy-bad pain all the time in my right foot. I've been told that my arches are probably collapsing, but... with trying to make my knees work correctly, I've noticed a fairly good improvement on that issue. I might have to save up money and get the really, crazily expensive special running shoes. Ugh.
jsheridan · 3/16/2014
I have run about a dozen half marathons as well as one full. There are many potential causes, aside from the shoes that were discussed, and starting slow (ie if you just started poling and did 3 days of strengthening in a row, you could also hurt yourself), you mentioned you were intentionally compensating for your crooked gait. For some people, corrective shoes help because they are hitting the way you are "supposed" to. However, for me personally, I have crooked knees and run slightly crooked. If my shoes try to correct that, my feet/knees are in excruciating pain and I cant run for weeks. I am better in a mimalist shoe that lets my legs do what they naturally want to do. You say you go barefoot a lot, so if you are wearing a corrective shoe for the first time, you will be using muscles you are not used to and impacting your joints in a whole new way. Also, what is your running surface? Concrete sidewalks are extremely hard and the impact can cause some pain. As can asphalt. Try running on a track or other softer surface for additional cushioning. A last factor to consider is may just be running with poor form. You say this is your third run ever. Many people have poor running form that takes time to develop, so it might help to go to a specialist that can do a gait analysis. A running store (not a sporting goods store, but one specific for running) may be able to guide you. A local physical therapist may also be able to direct you to someone. Hope that helps!
Legs4Days · 3/16/2014
I don't run and I have had 2 stress fractures. The first one caused the second becuz the toe bones shift up and over and hit the other toe bone! It was awful the first time and the second time (now) is not as bad but bothersome. It didn't show up on xray rite away....I had to come back in 10 days, and there it was.
MonikaB · 3/16/2014
Hi Runemist! So sorry to hear about your pain! It is great that you enjoy the running tough so don't give it up! Any of the above suggestions are possible! I would say though that if the pain is that servere and keeps occurring then you should go see a sports doctor who might then refer you to a physio/biokineticist or podiatrist.. Make sure though that whichever doctor you see is either a runner themselves or is used to dealing with runners! Good luck and hope you get back on the road soon! Xo
Runemist34 · 3/16/2014
jsheridan: I don't exactly have a "crooked gait," I have fucked up knees. Particularly, my gait is fine, but unfortunately there are certain muscles that aid in keeping my kneecaps in place that have been very weak for a long time, thus causing the kneecaps to move, and grind against my femur on the inside when I bend. It hurts and it sucks, and my assumption is that my arches are unhappy because my knees have had this tendency to want to collapse inward when I'm standing around or whatever. It's more of an issue with the movement of my hips, and I've been working on it a lot- they are much happier, much stronger, and have much less pain these days than they ever have. I do actually go barefoot at all times that I can feasibly do so- if I could go outside barefoot, I would. I hate socks, and by proxy, I hate shoes. They restrict my foot movement and generally screw me up, and always have. When I was a kid, nothing could keep my shoes on! I'm not sure that I'm wearing a "corrective shoe," though I think I did once and it really hurt for a long time. I don't think I had those shoes around for... more than a few months. As for my running surface, I have a trail around back of my house that is mostly just... trail. Dirt, and such. L4D and MonikaB, Thank you for you support :) I'll probably just see my doctor on Tuesday if I can, and find out what he/she says. And, as for the physio... unfortunately, I can't afford that. $50 per session could be a hell of a lot of food that I, my boyfriend, and my roommate would miss eating. Might possibly be able to see a podiatrist though Oo;
jsheridan · 3/17/2014
I do think seeing the doctor is a good plan! Many running shoes are corrective to some degree, ie they prevent pronation, etc. They do marginally change your gait. Some are neutral, but not many. If you have bad knees in that sense, it can translate into pain in other parts of the body because you are favoring one. When my knee was injured (kicked by a horse) I got severe plantar fascitis because I was trying to minimize the stress in my knees so it went into other joints. This is extremely common, esp with legs because they are long, so a small deviation in your knee results in extreme deviation at the next joint up or down. I think a doctor who specializes in it will be able to watch you move to see what the cause may actually be.
Prplegrl10 · 3/19/2014
I went to a running store to be fit for my shoes and they watched me walk barefoot and determined I am a neutral and only showed me shoes that would work for me. I am fairly new to running having done a few 5ks, and 1 10k. I am currently training for a 10 miler and noticed that as my runs are starting to be longer my shins and ankles bother me more if I try to run too close together. I am also training with hills so that is part of the issue in learning how to slow my pace downhill. My shoes were right around $100 so I don't feel they were horribly expensive (Brooks Ghost). Good luck and hopefully you will be running pain free soon. There is no high like a running high!
Sassafrassle · 3/20/2014
TBH, in my experience, a physio would probably just tell you you have weak glutes if you're having knee pain - it seems to be quite a standard answer! Maybe I'm being a bit cynical though... I've been running for a while and I know that I will go through times where a particular thing hurts and it mostly seems to mean I have an imbalance and something in my legs needs strengthening. However, it's probably a good idea to know what kinds of things maybe coming into play there I guess. Doing some general leg strengthening things might be worth it if you have the time and aren't doing them already though. There's a lot that can interplay in terms of muscles and maybe something's compensating for a weakness elsewhere. Trying out some running drills probably wouldn't be a bad idea either, to try and improve your technique in case it needs a bit of tweaking. There must be some tutorials online for those but hit me up if you want some descriptions of some to get you started. It's a shame that you don't have a few spare $$ laying around because I know at least where I live (which is a small country!), there are running seminars which you can go along to and the coaches will examine your gait and give you advice and drills to do.
kasanya · 3/20/2014
In Canada, the place to go for running shoes is the Running Room. You'll end up paying a little more, but they will spend a lot of time with you and do a gait analysis and make sure you have the right shoes for you. It's kind of like the running shoe equivalent of spending more up front to get a real pole instead of cheaping out on a Carmen Electra pole you'll have to replace with a real pole anyway. They also offer really good "learn to run" and "train for race of X length" type programs. @Sassafrassle: Chances are the physio would say exactly that and would be completely right. Most chronic and/or mystery knee pain is a symptom of muscle imbalances in the hips. If you have something wonky going on with your feet or ankles, it can also be referred up from there. Anyway, if it were me and I could only afford to see a medical professional once for a problem like this, I would go to a physiotherapist and ask for an assessment from the hips down. Once you know exactly which muscles are too weak and which are too tight, you can use Google and YouTube searches to figure out how to fix your specific problems. @Runemist: You should check what BC healthcare can cover. In Alberta, healthcare can cover your first 2 physio appointments for a problem (6 if you qualify as low income). You just have to call around and find a physio clinic that hasn't used up their quota of paid slots yet. You may have access to something similar. Good luck!
Runemist34 · 3/20/2014
RIGHT so there's a couple things for updating people on: First, the running. I did go to the Running room, as per you guys and also my cousin, and my own suspicions. The shoes I got were VERY freaking expensive ($160!!) but, I like them and I don't feel like I'm fighting them constantly. Apparently I have a fairly straight, neutral gait, which is good, and I also have high arches, so that also means that I need a neutral shoe (because correction either way will screw me up). So, that's what I have. Actually, they're the same as PrpleGrl10's! Brooks Ghost. I've also done a bunch of research into the feeling of pain I was having, and in particular was tipped off toward tendinitis (which, this early in the game, is not possible, but I entertained the idea of it BECOMING that, as I'm very prone to tendinitis). In particular what I found that there is, in fact, a tendon that attaches to the side of the foot, runs through your ankle, and attaches to the soleus muscle in your calf (I believe). Being that my soleus has probably never had a call to arms like that before, it's probably fairly weak, leading to the major pain. I've taken up doing exercises on my stairs for the poor muscle, and hopefully it'll figure it's life out soon. On the topic of my knees, and physiotherapy: My knees, both of them, have what's called "patello-femural syndrome," which is considered a sports injury, and was probably from my horseback riding days. In particular, it is caused by my outer quad muscle not being strong enough to pull my patella (the kneecap) over enough and keep it in the right place, so that when I bend my knees and it's in the wrong spot, it and my femur rub together and it's quite painful. The doctor gave me some exercises that actually made me worse, which is why I went to physiotherapy. The $50 per session, one hour for a session, was actually under my Mum's health care with her work. Otherwise, it would have been a lot more expensive. I couldn't technically even afford that, but my Mum was kind enough to cover it for me. I learned about which muscles, I was given some proper exercises, and have been on my own since. As of this month, I haven't had any "major" knee pain in almost a year, and I'm really pleased. I've not had to take days off for them, and I haven't been in constant pain for a long time. They twinge now and then, some days they're sore or kind of swollen, but this is far better than what I used to live with. Thank you for your advice and discussion