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I have to bring in my own students???
Hi everyone! I recently applied at a studio and they said, even before I’m considered, I have to bring in a few beginner dancers. That doesn’t seem completely fair to me.
Can some of you give me your opinions and maybe some advice on how to recruit dancers to a studio that I don’t even work at yet? Thank you so much everyone!
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19 Replies
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I don’t know anything about pole instructor positions,but bring in your own students? For what, so they can get them signed on? Sounds like they r using u to recruit!
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I just don’t want to work so hard on getting people and then get a “thanks, it was nice to meet you.” She hasn’t even seen me dance or met me in person. 🙁
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Trust your gut feeling. Why would you get students to sign up at a studio that you are not even teaching at? You plump their student roster and then what? What's in it for you? Personally I would pass and actively seek a different studio.
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I agree. It just sucks that they would do that 🙁
Thank you guys for helping out!
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Should I try to talk to them at all or should I just move on completely?
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I would move right along……something odd!!!
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Move on if you can. that is really fishy and if it smells like a fish, its most likely a fish.
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My perspective—-WALK AWAY.
I own a studio and would offer my staff commissions based on clients they bring in, but I would never expect them to "bring their own"
I have only been open 8 weeks, so we are still very much in infancy stages.
It would be another thing entirely if you were renting the space off them at an hourly rate, teaching students you already had……That would mean you were in business for yourself. Which—depending on where you are located, there are a whole lot of considerations and different laws about being a contractor/business owner. There are several wonderful threads on here about the topic……….MaryEllen is wonderful resource for answering them as well due to her ownership of studio, and her vast business background in the US. I am in Canada and things are a little different.
Anyway, back to topic at hand………..I wouldn't entertain it if they are looking to hire you as a staff member and you bringing in your own students is contingent on if you are hired or not.
Another note—if you bring the students in—-the studio will likely retain them. In some small prints, I have seen it written that the gym/studio/facility retains the proprietary rights to the students once you bring them in. Not sure how it would hold up in court if you took them with you if you left, but again—-might be another hassle that no one needs…..an tons of money spent on legal…..Again–MaryEllen has made some excellent replies on these topics if you search the forums.
Just some thoughts………….
Go with your instincts………..If it feels sketchy, I would look for an alternate studio to apply at.
Hugs
Reenie
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A pole studio owner offered me that "opporturnity" –I was like, if I want to build a practice, I can do that out of my OWN STUDIO! lol You're doing the labor and building their business aka "good will"
completely unfair- it was PureDelish in Culver City-no thank you… that's work and it takes money out of your pocket instead of putting it in!
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if they need you to bring in students, they must not be doing very well. i have had some similar experiences with massage therapy positions – where they wanted me to already have a clientele. but HELLO, if i had my own clients, i would have them come to my house!!!
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I agree with the other posts that this is a bad job offer. I have heard of similar situations for jobs beyond classes and pole fitness. Someone I know who already had a current full time job interviewed at another company. At the interview this person was told, "If we hire you of course you will be required to turn in your current client list from where you are right now." The person thought, "No I would not do that. My current employer could sue me for such an action."
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Ask if they can have the session for free and just bring a friend or two- or your family. Otherwise, I'd just ask them to explain their stance. Maybe their thinking is that everything comes down to a representation of their studio so in case you "mess up" they haven't lost anything(current customers) and you'd excel since you are trying to gain the new students and win over the studio; however I don't agree with what they are asking. You could maybe compromise and teach the instructors to do a "mock class". That way you and the studio don't have anything to "lose" and they have an idea as to your teaching style. Good luck!
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I agree with everyone here. I own a studio and would never ask someone to bring in clients before I would even considering hiring them as an instructor. That has nothing to do with the quality of your instruction. On the other hand, AFTER you get hired, it may be part of your job to advertise your classes and encourage people to come, but that shouldn't be a pre-requisite in order for you to get the job. I would certainly question their motives.
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I am the owner of Studio 409 for 4 years and when one of my instructor takes a student at Studio has always a percentage of profit. If she brings her own group, she rented the studio. Unfortunately all the studios are not like ours, of course you have to pay rent and make clear agreements but if you want to work in a positive atmosphere we must treat good the Instructors. Some schools are like factories, this is not what I chose and the mere fact that you asked the question answers it. You will find a better place dear.
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Thank you everyone for being so kind and helpful 😀 obviously I am choosing to go with another studio. Unfortunately no one is looking for instructors 🙁 ONE DAY! 😀
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Why not start your own? You could always leave your resume so in case they need it, they have it on hand. Good luck!
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Is this a dedicated pole studio or are they some type of studio looking to add pole dancing?
There are a few different circumstances out there. If you are an additional feature to their current (non pole) studio then I can see why they would ask you to bring in the clients. This was my first experience with teaching pole. I was renting a space from a fitness studio and while they promoted my classes to their current clients I was also supposed to bring in new clients. This scenario was pretty scary at first because I didn't know anyone at the time that saw the value of paying for lessons but after some advertising I had a few people come in just for the pole classes! Some of these girls still contact me today to teach them 🙂
Another circumstance is a pole dance studio hiring instructors. This is where I have a lot ot say on the subject. Typically in this scenario you should be responsible for marketing your classes and the studio is responsible for marketing the studio IF you are being paid a commision, IF you are an hourly EMPLOYEE not an INDEPENDANT CONTRACTOR then I would say your marketing responisbilities are marginal – but if you like you're studio you should help market it and get people in the door – just seems like the right thing to do.
If the positiion is pole isntructor and you will be teaching pole classes with their syllabus then they are responsible for bringing people in. If you are paying rent and teaching your own syllabus then I can see why they would say bring people. Now, in this situation the people you bring are YOUR clients NOT the studios. If you are in anyway REQUIRED to bring them in then you keep them when you leave. In this case you should NOT be signing a non-compete agreement, you would be a tenant of the facility and therefor your own business like other people have said. This can be very advantageous to you if you want to teach but don't want the overhead of owning a studio. I have worked like this before and don't mind so long as everyone is clear. This means for me that no one working at the studio and not for me can take my classes.
Another possibility presuming this is a pole dominant facility is that they need clients and the owner doesn't want to pay for marketing so she's expecting the instructors to do HER job for her. Unless you get commission don't do it. This will only help the lazy owner market her facility and then get rid of you as your first post says.
Some questions to ask during an interview at a pole studio
1) Am I an employee or an independant contractor? (If the latter please educate yourself on your rights as an IC)
2) Is training provided? If NO, huge red flag, run, run, run! A studio should care about having good quality instructors, they should be making efforts to make sure that you are safe before hiring you on.
An ammendment to this is they require to be CERTIFIED in pole dancing, however it is my opinion that you can be certified in pole dance education but you will still need some training on how to do things at that particular studio. Your training should include more than how to run the computer, btw.
3) Where do the lesson plans come frome?
I'll use my current studio as an example. I teach a class that I have to make up choreography for however I am given guidelines based on moves. I can only teach X amount of things and a certain level of moves to which the owner has given me an outline of what can and cannot be taught in the class. Since the class is choreo based it only makes sense that I am required to write my own. Again be sure you are getting paid for this. You need to decide how much it costs for you to bring in your own stuff.
Another example is a studio that provides a syllabus – this might be a more trick based class. If they are giving you the moves in order of what to teach and how to teach them expect to make less money because the studio has done the work for you.
My final example is a situation I was in. YOU are coming up with everything! You decide what moves, in what order, if there will be choreo, if there won't, you decided when to teach what move when – you are in full control. Please, please, please if this is the case think about being a tenant instead of an instructor because your BRAIN is worth money too. Don't let the studio ever have pocession of your syllabus and don't let them try to pay you a flat rate. This would be a commission situation. Typically if this is the scenario then it's because the owner either doesn't pole dance or has little knowledge of pole dancing. If I had a studio my instructors would not be given free license to teach as they please.
4) If you are striclty commission based, ask if your commission rate will change based on the studio running a sale.
Example – the studio runs a groupon 4 classes for $25. Let's say you get 50% commission and typically those sale classes are $25 at regular price. You typical cut would be $12.50/student. Do you get the 12.50 for a groupon or do you get $3.12/student? That's a big difference in pay. I am of the opinion that an instructor should not make less than her typical rate because the studio ran a sale. This is one reason why I feel like flat rates are better than commission deals. This is extremely important. It's up to you what you want to do with this information.
5) How many students are you expected to teach MAX at once?
Why is this important? Because if you are on a flat rate and a studio wants to pay $20/class but teach teach 10-15 people at a time, you should be making more money.
6) What is the student to pole ratio?
If a studio is trying to get you to teach more than 3 students/pole this is a very difficult task.
7) How long has the studio been in business and what are the qualifications of the other instructors?
Does anyone at this place have any kind of qualification or equivilant experience to be running group fitness classes? If NO ONE has any kind of credentials, RUN! Even if instructors don't have credentials at least one person should. Not only that, but there should be an apprentice program or training program. There should be a method to the madness and if there isn't – that's a big red flag. It's important to find out what the owner believes qualifies someone to teach – do they simply hire dancers that are good or do they hire people that can break down moves? Your interview should include you teaching something (and it should be basic, don't let someone get you to break down advanced moves so they can learn stuff for free, that happens!)
8) What is the company mission statement?
Every business has a mission statement. You need to know this because it defines what type of pole studio it is. Is it a fitness pole studio? A movement pole studio? A trick based pole studio? Keep in mind that a fitness studio might have some dance programs but it's important that the studio have a clear vision of who their clientele is and what clients can expect from the business. So, if you are hired to teach a sexy dance class at a fitness based studio you might find that your class struggles a litte, this doesn't mean you shouldn't do it because I think it's important to *try* to encompass all the aspects pf pole but it's something you need to be aware of. Maybe you are teaching a hard core pole fitness class at a movement based studio – this might be a tough sell. On the other hand, it has also been my experience that off brand classes can be very successful because they are extras that the studio doesn't really brand as their thing. Make sense?
9) What is the typical student retention?
Do a lot of students stay? Do they stay for a few levels and move on? Do they quit right away?
Studios with good retantion rates most likely means that the instructors are good and friendly, that the business has good customer service and reasonable rates for the experience provided and above all that the product is probably pretty good.
Studios with a pretty small following or low retantion rates usually means the business aspect is being run well and that the instructors may not be that well trained. To, me this all goes back to management – but it's not a place you want to work.
10) How do the other instructors get along?
Do the instructors support each other? Are they all equally giving and taking? Are you going to be the most advanced person there and have people constantly ask you to show them things? If so, then you need to get paid for that.
Do instructors take each others classes? There's 2 ways about this one. At my studio now we do take each other's classes because we all LOVE each other and we LOVE each other's style. 1 reason why this works is because we either teach a syllabus (which we all know) or we teach level based choreography so it's not like someone is coming up to me asking to learn a fonji – they'd probably book out a lesson with me for that. So because we all know the rules, guidelines and material when we take from each other it's really fun to learn and get inspired.
Another situation is if you are creating your own classes and determining every single thing. This is where I don't like other commission based instructors in my class. My experience has been that they are only taking my class because they are responsible to creating their own later int he week and they are going to teach pretty much everything I taught, I don't like this because I worked hard on putting those classes together keeping in mind all the different levels of students who would be attending. I should be able to attend someone else's class and not have my stuff regurgetated back at me. I also feel that commission based instructors are pretty competetive with each other and because they get paid based on clients and may even share clients it's in the best interest of everyone to stay out of each other's classes so you don't start feeling like someone on your home terf is trying to steal your clients…I just don't like it.
Sorry I know this is really, really long and not everyone is going to agree with me but hopefully some of what I've said will help instructors find studios that fit them. Remember you have to be a good fit for the studio as well as it be a good fit for you. Owners and instructors need to protect themselves.
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Charley- thank you so much! You sound like a very experienced and knowledgable dancer/instructor 🙂 You have given me SO much help! I have absolutely no idea what to ask studios during an interview, so thank you!
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😀 I'm glad I could help Shelly. There are exceptions to every example I gave I'me sure. I've been in a lot of different situtations and there are benefits and deficits to each for sure. This biggest thing, is make sure that you and the owner mutually respect each other and can work together.
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