[StellarMotion]

Hi Everyone! I’m reluctant to compare this to the hands-free pretzel in spite of the obvious similarities. I think the important differences include: 1) the arm grip is not just in a different place, but is on the opposite arm, 2) the hip/side is not on the pole, but rather the small of the back is curled across it. I essentially think of the pretzel as a Scorpio performed in an upright position, because all the body grips are identical. But I think the Chopsticks move that Joni posted is more similar to this move than the pretzel is.

It would be possible to get into this position from a pretzel, however the top hand would have to be released and slid to the opposite side of the pole, after the torso was tilted from front-facing to sideways. Then the ankle could be kicked off the pole and the leg elongated. But I think it would be easier to get the torso and gripping arm in position from a basic pole sit than from a pretzel.

I’ve been calling this move a "Zorro slash," by the way, since the gripping arm, torso, and gripping leg produce a skewed Z shape. But somehow "Chantel" seems kind of fitting. I would love to find out what Jenyne is calling the move. Jessalyn performed this move in one of Jungle Cat’s recent videos on YouTube, which was my first exposure to it. Maybe she knows a name for it…!

[StellarMotion]

Hi! Great to have you around. I love watching your videos.

[StellarMotion]

Hi Blueeyes! I love that move, but I don’t know the name of it. I’ve been trying to get into that move too, but am not yet getting it exactly right. The grips are on the top of the bicep by the shoulder along with part of the armpit, diagonally across the back to part of the hip/side, and across the inner thigh. This move is odd because it requires the back to be bent around the pole, from what I have been able to tell with my tries at it. I did a sideways version of this in my December challenge, but the front-facing version is prettier. If you get this move, please share all your pointers with me! I’m going to keep working at it too.

[StellarMotion]

Hi Empyrean!

I looked at your profile picture and now I’m curious; did I recently comment on a wonderful performance that you posted to YouTube? Perhaps you only resemble the lady I had in mind, but if it was you, I was very impressed. Accept my apology if I am mistaken.

I reread my comments about overhand grips and thought myself to sound tactless and authoritative, and wish I had presented my experience differently. Please understand that there is something I recognise about myself, and that is that even though I can perform some advanced moves, that only makes me a beginning dancer who can perform some advanced moves, not an advanced dancer, and I have little experience with instruction. Please accept my effort to humble myself.

Let me first share that I was under the imrpession that the traditional Chinese pole acrobats performed their flagpole move using a grip with both thumbs facing in toward each other. It is highly possible that I have been inaccurate. I thought that this was the difference between the Chinese grip and the True grip, which both use an overhand grip in the top bracket, but I am entirely open to being corrected. I wonder if possibly the old Chinese grip was eschewed by Western acrobats in favor of a more practical thumb down in the lower bracket.

This may speak to how out-of-the-loop I am in regard to formal pole training since I’ve never had the privilege of having studio time with an instructor, but I didn’t even know that overhand grips were being taught to users of dance poles! I thought it was something primarily used on the Chinese pole. After reading your post I feel inspired to attempt to do some work with overhand grips.

My previous trouble with overhand grips, aside from feeling kind of uncontrolled, is equally an issue of hand strength as arm strength as I really feel like my hand will slide right off the pole. Do you think that this might speak more to technique involved in the way I tried to use this grip than it has to do with the grip itself? I would enjoy any suggestions you have about using overhand grips and the moves for which this grip is useful. Perhaps the "true grip" deserves its own thread on this board!

[StellarMotion]

There are some really good exercises that Veena recommends on her YouTube channel. She teaches an exercise with light weights for strengthening the wrists and forearms, and another exercise for strengthening the shoulders, especially the rear deltoids and rhomboids. For me, those videos were an absolute Godsend, because my left forearm and shoulder would sometimes hurt badly after intense poling, especially when using split grip, and I feel that the exercises Veena recommended in her tutorials strengthened the muscles enough to support those joints, so that I could continue doing the same moves in a more comfortable and safer way. I kinda messed up my rotator cuff a little bit when I got my first "cartwheel mount," because I was overusing it before I was strong enough. I feel that these exercises "cured" whatever minor injury I had caused myself. When I go to the gym, I still do her YTI formula, and her wrist/forearm exercises. Maybe if you start these exercises while you are saving to buy your pole, you can get a head start on protecting your joints and strengthening the muscles that will get taxed heavily by some challenging pole moves.

Also, if you don’t have a gym membership or some light handweights of your own, Veena suggests in her video that you can do those exercises with other household items such as canned foods, since it is important to start these exercises with lighter weights. You can even benefit from doing these exercises without additional weights.

Cardiovascular exercise has helped my poling. For a long time I was only doing strength training, but no cardio, so that I could get stronger and larger without losing weight. So I was able to learn some pole moves requiring some strength quickly, but would get winded too easily. Pilates, yoga, and other exercises that use only the resistance of your own body weight while simultaneously giving you a stretch can be immeasurably valuable. There’s a lot of abs and lats involved in inverts, so exercises engaging those muscles can be immeasurably helpful. Truthfully, as trite as this may sound, since poling is basically a full-body workout, almost all exercises can be helpful. For performing beginner moves like some spins and basic laybacks, strengthening your biceps, abs, lats, and shoulders will be a huge help. If you’re fit and flexible already, you’ll be able to learn some advanced moves pretty fast; but if you’re not fit and flexible yet, poling can help you get there in a major way. Either way, you win!

Here are the links to Veena’s exercise tutorials. I swear by these.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BC610fJ9K8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8QzZnFkXn8

[StellarMotion]

*Bump!

Because I wanna know if you’re still slipping.

[StellarMotion]

I forgot, I also wanted to mention that that practicing the Flag and it’s variations can help greatly with brass monkey, if brass monkey is one of the goals being worked toward. The flag position is an excellent way to mount and dismount from brass monkey.

[StellarMotion]

Hi folks!

All this talk of caterpillar and the trouble it poses made me wonder if some talk of technique might be helpful, so I wanted to share the method I use for the climbing caterpillar. This is not the only way to perform this move, and it’s not necessarily the right way, it is only a way to do it.

So the way I perform this move is that I get into inverted crucifix position, put both my hands on the pole near one-another with thumbs facing down and push out from the pole, not up. After pushing myself out, then I begin pushing up while simultaneously pulling up with the thighs. My biggest problem learning this move was that I wanted to push upward first, not realising that this move wasn’t exclusively a matter of shoulder strength, but that it engages the whole body, distributing its weight among various muscle groups working together. So after I have pushed out, and then elevated so that my chest is near the pole and my bum is sticking out, I use the elbow grip to let go of the pole with my legs, and move them to a higher position, so that I am in inverted crucifix position again and ready to push out from the pole a second time to repeat the process.

For myself, I will share that the key that unlocked the upper body strength moves for me was the cartwheel mount handspring. After I got that move, then I had enough confidence to hold myself away from the pole upside-down in other positions, like Aysha and Straight Edge. Personally, I like the split grip and the twisted grip for performing Aysha and Straight Edge on a static pole, because the "wow factor" is a little higher for these, and they allow you to move with a little more control and freedom. I do, however, like to use the elbow grip to do a grossly extended Aysha where my back and hips are level with the floor. And I will use ONLY the elbow grip for Ayshas on the spinning pole, because otherwise I fear losing my top bracket throwing myself right off of the pole, or not being strong enough to keep balanced.

Last, I wanted to address overhand grips which were talked about in this thread. These are grips where the top bracket has the thumb pointed downward. Maybe there are others who find these grips, such as the "true grip" (both thumbs down) and the "Chinese Grip" (both thumbs facing each other) easier than myself, but I think these are the most unstable and physically taxing grips possible. Try a cartwheel mount handspring with the overhand grip and you might understand. My experience with those grips is that I can get myself up, but I have to be mentally prepared to make an impromptu landing, because otherwise, I will fall. If a grip is needed that requires less physical exertion, the elbow and forearm grips are great for that. But still, working for these moves in split and twisted grips is a worthy goal with a big payoff!

[StellarMotion]

Amcut, I’m not glad to hear that you’re shedding and bruising, but I am glad to hear that someone is experiencing the same thing I am. My thigh bruises hurt to the touch too. Oddly, I’m "shedding" from my hip and underarm, but there is no pain or bruising on those areas. Seems a little Twilight Zone-esque to me. Thank you for being confident in me! And you’re right, if I have to use some chalk or mighty grip in performance, that’s not really so bad. I like your attitude and your advice. We should be pals!

Roxy, I am open to the idea that hormones have something to do with this. I’d love to think that this is just a phase and that its going to go away by itself.

Hi, Veena! I use lotion after every shower or bath, but I could try applying it a little bit before I pole too. This is my first Winter poling, so I guess it’s natural to have some trouble like this as I’ve not had a chance to pole through all the seasons. And I usually only pole when the radiators have been on for a little while because otherwise it’s too difficult to keep myself and my pole warm, but there’s a chance that Francine (my X-pole) and I are getting too warm. I’ll experiment with climate control. I’d prefer it to be hormones though!

Sissy! LOL, I’ve been getting a good laugh out of the PMS discussion too!

So ladies… can any of you spare a PMSing boy a handful of Midol? I’m trading in my ibuprofen now. LOL!

[StellarMotion]

Hi!

I don’t have any personal experience with the Elektra pole, but from what I understand the finish is chrome. Is that correct? If so, I can say something about that, because after I learned on a brass pole at a bar I frequent, my chrome X-Pole seemed like someone had smothered grease all over it before I tried to mount it.

I found out that while I could grip the brass pole okay with a minimal amount of warming up, I cannot do that on the chrome X-pole. That has become even more true as the weather has become cooler. I do about ten minutes of calisthenics on the floor, like lunges, push-ups, crunches, and a little Yoga, and then I proceed to climb the pole and slide down a few times with as much skin on the pole as possible. In fact, you watched me do that in chat once! But maybe you didn’t realise that’s what I was doing at the time. If I am right that the Electra pole is chrome finished, it seems reasonable to me to think that the same principle would apply. I would suggest that warming yourself and your pole should help a lot.

Also, my skin is a little dryer than some other peoples’, so I have to make sure I moisturise my thighs and hips and anything else I might try to grip the pole with. Dry skin won’t hold the pole. So even though it’s a bad idea to use the pole while lotions or moisturisers are on your skin because it can cause a fall, moisturising several hours before poling may be helpful. Any excesses of moisturiser can be removed with a towel, or even just by the clothing you wear before you begin your pole workout. Make sure your moisturiser isn’t too oily though. Also, as your body temperature comes up, your skin will moisturise itself with a little sweat.

So warming yourself and warming your pole should help. Now that I know how to warm myself and my chrome pole, sometimes I almost feel as though it is TOO sticky, instead of slippery. Warming a pole is time consuming and can be annoying, but it’s an important thing to do for your safety. Trying inverts or body grips on a cold, slippery pole can be dangerous! But if you and your pole are warm, your skin is conditioned well, and your pole is clean, you should be able to start doing pole sits and other beginner body grips safely. Also, I like to wash my hands with warm water and soap right before I get on my pole, because unlike the rest of my body, sometimes my hands need a little drying out to get a good grip that I can hold for a while. Plus, if I have anything slippery on my hands, it will make the pole slippery any time I try to hold it with any body part. It sounds basic and silly to even say, but its easy for me to forget to wash my hands before poling, even though it makes a big difference sometimes.

I hope this helps! Last, if you pole in a room that’s usually cold, I recommend putting a space heater in the general vicinity of your pole for a few minutes before poling. Someone on this forum also suggested a hot blow dryer to warm the pole, which sounds like good, common sense to me.

I was relieved to find that my X-pole wasn’t teflon coated, but rather it was just cold. I hope that the same is true of the Elektra pole.

Oh, yeah, and I hope you don’t have to use this pole for too long before you get to have one of the safer, stronger, more-reputable ones. I’m in love with X-pole and recommend it to everyone. It’s a low-cost pole when contrasted with its reputation and what it offers, and the customer service at X-pole is fantastic. On the subject of customer service, though, I doubt Carmen Elektra, or the obese men in suits who are mass producing and selling her pole would take the time to tell you how to get the most use out of your pole.

[StellarMotion]

Hi, friends. This message isn’t an absolute no, but I did want to express the unlikeliness of my attendance at the jam. I’m going to have to purchase a new mobile phone, which will set me back financially, after a weird (almost freak) accident landed mine in a glass of water. That, combined with the surprise of "adopting" a teen friend who has been having trouble at home, have placed a certain financial burden on me. So if providence supplies funds I certainly want to meet and dance with all of you! But do not be surprised if it proves impossible.

[StellarMotion]

Are we still dabbling with dates or is the 16th set in place? Is there anyone who is not able to attend a function on the 16th that would prefer a different day, or is 16th fine for most of us?

Also, if I’m not mistaken, MissJulie, SimpllySweet, and myself are the only people who have commented here expressing interest in the jam, who would be traveling from outside of the DFW area. Is that correct? Everyone else on this thread is in DFW?

What would our studio hours be? I ask this to find out whether it would be most practical to stay one night or two and which night, for motel reservations. Perhaps the 15th and 16th would be smartest, or so it seems to me.

I hope I can go. I still don’t promise. I do need to take a trip visit my parents and Emma, the family dog, sometime in January. Also I’ve been saving for the X-Stage! I hope it’s an option soon. Anyhow, will be in touch with you all here on the board soon!

[StellarMotion]

LOL Sissy, I figured you’d be doing it a lot now. When I got my cartwheel mount handspring I was so excited about it that I did it every time I was near a pole for weeks. Funny thing is, nailing my handspring was what gave me confidence (and probably strength) to do inverted split grip moves. That’s what I want to do all the time now too… so we’re kind of in the same boat! I just love doing the straight edge in split grip.

[StellarMotion]

I’m sure you’ll get to see it in person soon… this was only the first of many, many split grip straight edges for Sissy. Soon she’ll be doing it all the time, I bet!

[StellarMotion]

Oh Wow, Sissy, that was fantastic! I can only imagine how happy that must have been!

[StellarMotion]

Hi folks.

So I e-mailed Karyn and she has no problem with me joining in on the fun with all of you talented ladies.

Also, is it safe to assume that most RSVPs thus far are locals to the DFW area, and would therefore not have a need or interest in alternative lodging such as a hotel? I’ve been writing e-mails to some of the hotels in the general vicinity of The Girls’ Room in order to inquire whether or not a conference rate would be available to those of us who won’t be enjoying the comfort of our own homes while we are visiting Dallas.

For the record, it’s almost certain that I wouldn’t be able to make a December pole jam, as my boss informed us well in advance to take any necessary time off in November or arrange for it in January. I work as a bartender in an upscale restaurant that is always heavily booked with company parties throughout the whole month of December, which aside from putting me in increased demand is also, typically, rather financially lucrative.

So if you meet in December, I’ll have to wish you all a good time and enjoy the videos you post vicariously, and just keep saving my pennies to go hang out with some of you in DC in a few months…! According to a certain feline among our ranks, it’s going to be off the hook! So with that said, however, I absolutely promise to make a January pole jam, but the likelihood of my attending would be high.

Having said that, if December is the most convenient time for the majority of you then, by all means, please follow through!

So whatever the case, I’ll get back to you all as soon as I hear back from any of the Dallas hotels I’ve been in contact with, when any of them do get in touch. I’ve contacted a range of standard motels and resort hotels alike, and will be inquiring about December and January dates both!

[StellarMotion]

Hi Twista,

I don’t always feel totally comfortable giving advice about pole moves here, since I’m not as experienced as some others on this site. However since this topic has gone several days without a reply, I felt inclined to share my experience with the Genie. I am not an expert at this move, nor do I have any formal training in pole dance or fitness, so this is only my experience. This isn’t necessarily the only way to learn Genie, or even the best way, but it is a way, and it’s how I conditioned myself for Genie.

First, it took me a little while to figure out that much of the instability I felt when releasing my hands was not from my thigh-grip, but rather it was core. For some reason, it seems that it is harder to hold straight through the abdomen in this pose than in the knee hold or other positions. I realised after several hand releases that my arm strength was not compensating for my lack of thigh-grip so much as it was compensating for core. But the knee hold could possibly be used as one exercise to help develop strength through the oblique to hold this pose. Likewise the Cupid (that’s the one with one the lower foot/ankle on the pole, while the higher leg is hooked around the pole at the knee, I think. If I am in error, please do correct me, anyone!), or a side-facing flag (instead of facing the floor). You can do sidebends also, with one foot on the floor and the other hooked around the pole by the top of the foot or behind the knee. I personally do this just as a conditioning exercise.

As for the thighs themselves though this pose isn’t easy still even if your core strength is mammoth. I push really hard with my arm before releasing to make sure the pole is deep in my knee pits, and squeeze really hard with the hamstring. Your legs will hurt while you are getting used to this. I find that if my legs are out kind of wide, it is a little easier to hold. Maximum straddle is good for learning, but if you get more comfortable in Genie later on, the wow-factor increases a little if your knees are closer together enabling you to get further from the pole. You won’t push your hips as far forward as you do for a knee hold (though they still need to be forward, just not to the same degree), so you have the luxury of getting some extra leverage by pressing your lower thigh against the pole instead of relying exclusively on squeeze factor.

Practice this close to the floor so that you can put a little of your weight on your lower hand on the floor while building strength for this move, as long as that is necessary. Also, it will be easier to catch yourself if you start to slip a little. Make sure you are comfortable in a handsfree Genie close to the floor before trying it higher on the pole. A spot and crash pads are always a good idea if those are luxuries you have access to.

By the way, keep a towel nearby. If your kneepits are sweaty this can be a pretty dangerous move to practice, so be sure to take a moment to dry off a little bit if you’re feeling moist before having another attempt.

I hope that these suggestions are helpful, and also, I hope that it was shared tastefully enough. I respect that this is someone else’s studio space, and hope that I haven’t crossed any boundaries inappropriately.

But once your hold is secure, this move can look very pretty, especially on spin mode. Doing swimming arms, or belly-dance style snake arms can look really cute in the Genie hold! I’ll post a Genie demo (not tutorial) in a couple days, when I set my pole back up at home. I loaned it to a friend who has a pole enthusiasm for a couple days, just to help keep myself off of the bloody thing, and give my body some needed rest. Practice does make perfect, or close; but overpractice does something else entirely! Haha!

Good job on getting the Genie with hand, and good luck on getting it handsfree!

[StellarMotion]

Hi everybody! Considering that since I’ve joined StudioVeena I have received nothing but kindness and support, I never expected that any of you would reject me from a pole jam! I did, however, think that it would be respectful if we asked Karyn about me using her studio with the rest of you. After all, she did name her studio "the Girls’ Room," which sounds like she had something specific in mind for her studio. I’ll try e-mailing about it through her site.

By the way, I’ve not been in contact with any hotels yet. I’ll try to find some on the internet that are near that studio and ask what the requirements are for conference rate eligibility. Also, are we anywhere near having a "head count" for very likely joiners?

[StellarMotion]

Do you think Karyn would allow a guy to join in on the fun? I don’t know if I’ll be able to come up with enough money by then, but I’m sure willing to try, as long as the studio will have me.

I will even bring my X-pole to set up at the hotel if anyone’s down for some afterparty. I know that if I am surrounded by polers I’ll feel too inspired to just have two hours of studio time and then quit. Maybe we could even book a host of rooms in a hotel that offers a conference rate and get a modest discount across the board for all of us who are traveling there. I would be willing to do some research and phone calling.

[StellarMotion]

Veena, thank you for the tip about exporting to QT. I will remember that from now on!

Sassafrassie, thank you for your experience and suggestions. I found everything you suggest to be agreeable and I’ll work on implementing more of your suggestions and Veena’s next time I record something. Perhaps acting, expressing and emoting could be a future monthly challenge? I know it certainly challenges me just as much as the acrobatic stuff!

[StellarMotion]

I just read something sounding a lot like that comment recently and I think I may know exactly what Roxy’s talkin’ about! It’s from Miss Pole Dance New Zeland that competed at world this April.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I57YegUxg5g" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Roxy, was it this one? I just love watching this lady’s videos! Her name is Amy Richardson Impey. The only part I noticed where she’s holding on with one hand is where she enters and exits a pretzel pose while aerial. The grip to me looks very similar to the top bracket of the twisted grip, but with no lower bracket. It’s very pretty! So when my body is ready for another practice, I’ll attempt to do this. But I don’t think my body is gonna have it today… https://www.studioveena.com/img/smilies/icon_bounce.gif

[StellarMotion]

Hi Poleophile! I’m not sure what I might have done wrong when I was trying to upload that vid to this site, but I have put it on YouTube now instead. I have the same name, StellarMotion, for my YouTube channel. Do you have a YouTube channel? If so we could be friends there! https://www.studioveena.com/img/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif

[StellarMotion]

HI Midkid… Thinking maybe confidence in a man looks like chest up, abs in, shoulders back and low, head tilted slightly upward? I’m just trying to visualise it. Does that sound anything close to what you had in mind? More a posture thing than a face?

Veena! Thank you! I felt slightly incompetent for not knowing how to emote well, and after reading your post I feel a little bit better. I know that I have expected too much from myself being the beginning poler that I am. I hope that as I start to develop through practise and repetition the kind of comfort you describe with the moves, that more of my attention can be directed toward feeling the music and expressing the feeling. It’s only been since about July that I really started trying to learn pole dancing moves and techniques, and since I have no training in dance I understand that what you say is true. I will trust that it comes with time. I’m sure that some trial and error is involved too, so I guess I have to be willing to make errors. https://www.studioveena.com/img/smilies/icon_neutral.gif

I like your tip about not looking at the camera or audience when dancing to a sad song. If only I would have read that tip before posting my last practice! Haha. I recorded a practice with a Siouxsie and the Banshees song playing and posted it on Sunday, in which I caught myself looking at the camera more than once, when in fact my whole intention with that dance was to exorcise some melancholia.

Thanks for referring me to your Smile video… I thought it was very touching. I see exactly what you’re talking about and I’ll try to take a lesson from it! Aside from that, the aerial shoulder mount (and some other moves) looked unbelievably beautiful! Thanks so much for sharing your experience.

Poleophile, thank you for the comment! I will bookmark that site and look at it this week. You are a really kind lady! And your Gemini picture looks just great!

Haha, Sissy! Please share what you find when you "look into" your work!

[StellarMotion]

Hi Melly,

Thanks for posting and introducing yourself. I am a new member at this community too and I love it here so far. Veena and others on this site are really eager to be helpful and offer encouragement.

How fortunate you are that you get to have instruction from REDKE71! I really want to learn to do a lot of the moves she does with the same apparent ease of execution she seems to have.

Kind regards,

-David

[StellarMotion]

I would love to attend a pole jam in Texas! I live in El Paso. I won’t have any chance to travel until January though, in case timing is a factor in planning the jam…!